Affection in my eyes

[maca]

Well I have a question and I KNOW there are those out there <NUGDE NUDGE> that may have some input.

Im in a V ... LR is the hinge. Her other C lives with us. Im having issues with SEEING affectionate exchanges between them. I have talked to LR about the fact that I dont want to SEE them kissing or that I dont want to walk in on them in bed together. I have also let her know that I DONT have issue with her saying "I love you" to him or hugs.

I know that they have sex and are affectionate with each other when Im not around.I also know that my ISSUE stems from MY OWN issues with not feling loved or worth being loved so much or that I may be left for someone better. Im working through these feelings.But as of right now I have to be honest with what I can handle and what Im not ready to handle yet.

I feel as though Im not being fair to LR or C by asking them to refrain from doing these things in front of me. As I stated before we are a V not a triad (nor will us 3 ever be.. striaght as a board).

Sooo.. . Just out of curiousity how do the rest of you address this.

[HappiestManAlive]

You're okay with him living there... You are okay with them talking and exchanging verbal affection... You don't put undo restrictions on their activities aside from a simple request that they not be physically affectionate when you're present - I assume (bad bad word) that you aren't a craazy manipulative prick who intentionally hangs around when you know they would normally expect you to not be for the express purposse of limiting their interaction... And you are AWARE of this one minor hangup and are working on it...

I'm sorry, was there a problem? :p

[LovingRadiance]

lmao hma.
You're answer leaves me trying REALLY hard not to giggle from where I sit on the couch with a laptop and with baby in my lap while Maca madly pecks his keyboard at his computer desk!!!

I'm defering comment to him since it's his thread. ;)

[maca]

HAHA no I dont hang around all day( I wish) I have 10 hrs a day that im gone for work and I leave at 6 am and C dosent have to go to work till 1 pm. so they have some solo time( as solo as it gets with 4 kids):)

I was just wondering how other have handled this if and when it has come up..

And I should say to my love you are great and doing a good job helping me along with MY issues and dont shoving anything down my throat. I love you more....

[HappiestManAlive]

And I should say to my love you are great and doing a good job helping me along with MY issues and dont shoving anything down my throat. I love you more....

THAT - that right there - is what poly has come to mean to me. :)

[greenearthal]

I would have to concur with the general sentiment that there seems to be no problem here. It sounds like everyone is doing their best, and that everyone accepts that everyone else is doing their best. So why put pressure on yourself to "progress" faster, when there appear to be basically no complaints?

Or put another way: why not take some time and appreciate what you've accomplished and what you've overcome to get exactly here rather than fret about not having gotten even further?

[maca]

I would have to concur with the general sentiment that there seems to be no problem here. It sounds like everyone is doing their best, and that everyone accepts that everyone else is doing their best. So why put pressure on yourself to "progress" faster, when there appear to be basically no complaints?

I did not quote the complaints (or frustrations) that LR is having cause I didnt think that was pertinent to the post. We are doing good working it through:)

[/QUOTE] Or put another way: why not take some time and appreciate what you've accomplished and what you've overcome to get exactly here rather than fret about not having gotten even further?[/QUOTE]

( Smack with 2x4 to the head) You are absolutly right green. Why worry about the weather this weekend when its beautiful outside right now... I think Ill go kiss LR now and tell her how much I love her.. Thanks green:)

[redpepper]

I don't get the bed arrangement you have???

I agree, it sounds totally fine to ask for some refrain from them when you are around if you are feeling uncomfortable. I kiss Mono goodbye when my husband has said his goodbyes and has left the room... kind of a last word and connection before he leaves. If we need to be connected we usually take it elsewhere so no one else witnesses. It just feels better. I don't kiss my husband in front of Mono either unless it's a quick peck.

It really isn't much of an issue any more. It used to be, but as we have threesomes sometimes now, the issue dropped quickly.

[LovingRadiance]

AHHHHH EEEKKKKKKKSSSSSS.
No bed arrangement.
Maca and I have a room and a bed.
C has his own room and happily his own bed.......


Sorry I didn't get past that line. Oopss... not supposed to be replying... .

[midnightsun]

Well, I haven't had a chance to introduce myself yet... but regardless I thought I'd jump right in and open my big fat mouth! :p

My husband and I are in a long term, committed marriage. However it developed (consentually and with much discussion) into an open marriage and we've discussed the possibility of having a poly marriage involving another, most likely a woman.

As far as seeing each other being affectionate with others, that is something that (in my younger days) I would've considered unthinkable and would've made me insanely jealous. So, I've spent a lot of time thinking about why I no longer think/feel that way.

#1. Trust: There is a level of trust between the two of us that I've never had with anyone else. He's had many opportunities and reasons to leave in the nearly 8 years we've been married. If he wanted to be with someone else, he would've long before now.

#2. Love: I love him truly and honestly and I LOVE seeing him happy, love seeing him turned on. It eventually occurred to me that anything that turns him on, turns ME on... but I don't have to BE the one turning him on. I just enjoy the thought that he's enjoying himself. I don't even have to be there for it to make me happy.

#3. Respect: I respect his desires as an individual. I respect the feelings of the person he's with, when he's with another. I do not take for granted that I don't have to earn his love & trust, that they should come automatically just because we're married.

I see trust in the words you've written in your past posts, that she is being honest with you about how she feels about you and her other C. You've been married a long time, she hasn't left you for anyone "better" and doesn't appear to be seeking someone "better." You trust her enough to allow and even foster her relationship with C. So, the issue is maybe that you don't trust yourself? That you don't think you're good enough for her?

I see clearly that you love her. The key for me in learning to be ok with seeing PDA between my Love and another is focusing on his happiness, his pleasure, his desire... learning to take my happiness from his, my pleasure from his, my desire from his... you get the idea.

You respect the relationship between the two of you, between LR & C, respect your family structure as well.

The foundation is there... just build it 1 brick at a time. Be willing to take small steps, and to have a signal that will let her & C know if you aren't ok with something so that they can respect your feelings as you work on respecting theirs.

Good luck! Sorry for being so long winded... I type fast!! :D

[sweetie]

Maca,

I'm just wondering. Are you wondering how other's deal with it, or do they feel the same way? Let me just say that yes, some of us feel the same way. You're dealing with it fabulously. You've stated your feelings and concerns, they've not only listened, but heard and have respected. Sounds like it's working for all of you. How do I deal with watching our hinge kiss his wife. :) I look at the floor, the ceiling, read my book, watch tv, and sometimes leave the room. But then Sea does the same. ;)

[LovingRadiance]

Hijack by maca



#1. Trust: There is a level of trust between the two of us that I've never had with anyone else. He's had many opportunities and reasons to leave in the nearly 8 years we've been married. If he wanted to be with someone else, he would've long before now.

There is alot to be said for trust.Its not that I dont trust her to not love me or want to be with me.We too have had opportunities to leave and at one point I did leave.There are still Insecurities Im dealing with from the affair LR had , although those insecurities of trust are fading fast with the new found honesty we are implementing in our relationship.


[/QUOTE]#2. Love: I love him truly and honestly and I LOVE seeing him happy, love seeing him turned on. It eventually occurred to me that anything that turns him on, turns ME on... but I don't have to BE the one turning him on. I just enjoy the thought that he's enjoying himself. I don't even have to be there for it to make me happy.[/QUOTE]

Im not turned on by her getting turned on by him( just not who I am) But I do see your point in being happy for her if he makes her happy, but I dont see as why I have to be witness to it.Maybe in time that will change.

quote#3. Respect: I respect his desires as an individual. I respect the feelings of the person he's with, when he's with another. I do not take for granted that I don't have to earn his love & trust, that they should come automatically just because we're married.

I see trust in the words you've written in your past posts, that she is being honest with you about how she feels about you and her other C. You've been married a long time, she hasn't left you for anyone "better" and doesn't appear to be seeking someone "better." You trust her enough to allow and even foster her relationship with C. So, the issue is maybe that you don't trust yourself? That you don't think you're good enough for her? quote

That is one of the issues I have posted about in other posts.Im working through those feeling of not being good enough. Mono has even sugested that it may be helpful if I posted my long list of hurts that lead me to no trusting ppl especially women.

quoteI see clearly that you love her. The key for me in learning to be ok with seeing PDA between my Love and another is focusing on his happiness, his pleasure, his desire... learning to take my happiness from his, my pleasure from his, my desire from his... you get the idea.

You respect the relationship between the two of you, between LR & C, respect your family structure as well.

The foundation is there... just build it 1 brick at a time. Be willing to take small steps, and to have a signal that will let her & C know if you aren't ok with something so that they can respect your feelings as you work on respecting theirs.

Good luck! Sorry for being so long winded... I type fast!! :D[/QUOTE]

You have left me with food for thought Midsun thanks for the reply:)

[midnightsun]

Hijack by maca

Im not turned on by her getting turned on by him( just not who I am) But I do see your point in being happy for her if he makes her happy, but I dont see as why I have to be witness to it.Maybe in time that will change.


I'm glad I gave you food for thought! ;) I posted not because I think you should change. You may not, and as others pointed out you're doing a good job at this point of being honest about your feelings and dealing with them up front. And youd should know it's ok if you don't change!

I thought it might be useful to you to see that my feelings changed through various relationships I've had and the process I went through to get there. Part of it may be the person I'm with now, but I also feel like it's because I've changed as a person. I've learned to feel good about who I am and what I have to offer in a relationship.

It's not that I think he can't live without me... it's that I know in my heart he doesn't WANT to. Therefore, why would he leave me when I'm willing to let him have whatever (and whoever) he wants as well as me? :p

[LovingRadiance]

Now that there are a number of replies-I feel like it's reasonable to put in some two cents to lead to more conversation about it.

When Maca told me he intended to start this thread he said he really wanted to know how other people deal with affection between their significant other and someone else. Almost "ideas" of options, because this is so new to him.

Yes C and I do respect that this is a difficult transition for him. But there have been issues.

Maca specifically addressed sex and kissing here-but neither C or I have any interest in exposing Maca to seeing us have sex for any number of reasons and we haven't kissed in front of him either nor do we feel a need.

However-as RP noted she reserves privacy for those things not only with Mono but also with her husband-that is not the case here. Maca in the past has made it a point to do anything and everything he can in front of C. (I believe as a way of saying "see this is mine").
Maca and I are quite affectionate publicly and that includes in front of C. C has never expressed any issue with this-but sometimes it does bother me. I feel like he's getting the shaft so to speak.

Additionally if I sit on the couch and put my head on C's lap-that bothers Maca, if I give him a hug it also bothers Maca if he deems it as lasting to long. It isn't JUST "sexual" affection that causes tension-it's any affection. Even when I say I love you-it causes a tension.

NOW-dont get me wrong-this dynamic change in our relationship is only a few weeks old. I am not complaining about what we have accomplished so far. It's great.
But we were talkign in the tub about my frustration in not knowing what I can or can't do in front of Maca, and that since this dynamic change my time with C has actually decreased.

We do have the mornings, but as I've said I also homeschool my kids and most of my morning is tied up with the kids. We enjoy working together with them, but that isn't alone time.
C and I don't get alone time. Maca and I do. C or Em will babysit so that Maca and I can go out to dinner or on a date and we always sleep together at night-ALWAYS. SO we do get alone time.

But Maca isn't comfortable with C and I having a date or going out together on our own. So C and I do not get time without the kids for ourselves. That is a bit of a struggle.

Anyway-thoughts from here would be great for both of us-as we are trying to find our common ground and could use some more suggestions and ideas to contemplate in our progression!

Thanks!!

[greenearthal]

I made a very dramatic transition in my life. I went from being a very monogamous minded, volatile and jealousy-prone person, to the polyamorous compersive, even-kkel fellow that I have become. I often tell my friends "I made it to the mountain top", because the who "what's the worst that could happen" exercise unfolded before my eyes, polyamory did it's worst to me and I came out the other side still polyamorous.

There were a ton of factors in my transition, but the main two factors were time and experience. I really don't see how I could have completed that transition any faster than I did and it took me two years (for most of the shift to be complete, I don't think you ever get to actually land and stop shifting).

And the only reason I think I was able to make such a radical shift so fast was because of a wealth of experiences of others that I could draw on. I met and spoke with and read about and befriended so many polyamorous people that I was able to figure out what about it could work for me and what I might be ready for someday but not now, and what just isn't ever going to be for me ever (there are some things that bring some polyamorous people great joy but just leaves me muttering "I just can't get down with that").

I really love the word compersion. I still remember the first time I heard Minx use it on Polyamory Weekly. And I said "Ah ha! That's where H wants me to go." But I was still not quite there yet. I was getting there, but there was a whole bunch of programming in my head about how unnatural it was to be okay with actually seeing "your woman" enjoying affection with and for another.

I guess all I can really say was that for me personally it was worth the time and effort it took to get the rest of the way there.

[maca]

I understand that ( and I believe LR does to ) that I can and will only progress at a health rate for ME. I love the fact that I can spill my thoughts out here and get helpful ,loving and nonjudgemental advice. The more LR and I talk the further I go( as LR says crawling out of a hole to see the wide open field).

I was looking for rules or ideas of what was an accepted amount of affection in front of the others. What I have learned is that really there are no rules there is just life, love, experience, compassion and self introspect.

[Ceoli]

I was looking for rules or ideas of what was an accepted amount of affection in front of the others. What I have learned is that really there are no rules there is just life, love, experience, compassion and self introspect.

Yahtzee!!

[LovingRadiance]

Ceoli-you are too cool and funny!!!

[maca]

Yahtzee!!



Am I the Winner????? :)

[redpepper]

I'm not sure what it is that C is getting out of this relationship the three of you have... I get that he has family out of it, but if you never have any time together LR then how are you to develop levels of connection and intimacy? Is there no time that Maca can look after your kids so that the two of you can go out, perhaps spend the night together and quickly jump back into your own bed before the kids get up (we do this on nights Mono sleeps over)?

I realize that this "question" arose only recently and also realize that there is a lot going on for the two of you in the way of counseling issues and a child moving in with you, but should this not be the time to sort out some logistics together for the long haul? I guess I am feeling kinda bad for poor ol C who doesn't seem to have a voice in all this.

I remember having a discussion with my husband at some point about how I felt I should stay two nights a week at Mono's and that he should stay nights at our house whenever possible. Granted we don't live together, so seeing each other in regular life is different, but my concern was about the fact that he (and I) needs closeness and private times with me just as much as my husband and I do. My husband agreed and now that is what we do... it translated into being more respectful about saying goodbyes (as I mentioned earlier) and eventually lead to sexual aspects of our relationships apart and together. When we are together there have been occasions where there is enough meditative silence that Mono, or my husband has watched affection between me and the other and really felt the love there. At least I feel as if that is what happens... it certainly is like that for me in that I feel like I am showing it. It has moved us to a place of bonding and connection that I didn't think possible. Complete compersion.

Maca, you were saying, "I was looking for rules or ideas of what was an accepted amount of affection in front of the others. What I have learned is that really there are no rules there is just life, love, experience, compassion and self introspect." The point I guess I am trying to make is that you are at where you are at and you can make rules/boundaries up as you go and change them as you go using love, experience, compassion and self introspection.... when the rule isn't working anymore it's time to look at it again.

[LovingRadiance]

RP-

That is EXACTLY what my issue is. I asked C to log in after work and answer your first question as honestly neither myself or Maca can answer what he gets out of it fairly.
I can answer and I'm pretty damn sure I know. But I feel he should speak for himself on that one.

I guess MY point is that I can grant Maca time to consider and contemplate what steps he needs taken to protect his inner self-because I really do see how hard he is working on dealing with it. But at the same time-there seems to be an issue for him in seeing that C is in a similar boat as Ceoli was. (not a triad-but he is a third).
When Maca read Ceoli's heartbreaking account of how her feelings were disregarded-it really tore him up. But he doesn't seem (I could be wrong-just saying what SEEMS to be) that he really see's the significance of C's position as being the same.

Ironically some of the issues you bring up aren't issues for C and I because we do have 16 1/2 years of deep loving friendship together and so we have a sense of confidence in the permanence of our relationship that many people don't have with their 3rd. The dynamics of our relationship may change, but as Mono said somewhere recently our love will never go away. We may change how we choose to show it-but we won't lose it.

Also-we aren't stuck in NRE at the moment-so there is no sense of "need" to be with one another every minute or talk every minute or whatever-which is something that often seems to make things a bit of a struggle when a couple first decides to go poly and one of them is in that it can increase their first partner's feelings of insecurity and concern of being "not good enough". For us that isn't an issue.

I can confidently say that C and I neither one want to do anything to make life harder for Maca. We both love him. While C has no desire to be intimate with Maca and Maca has no desire to be intimate with C, C does love Maca and respect him and is uninterested in "replacing" him in anyway.

I don't foresee sex being something that would happen between the three of us- or in front of each other ever. Not that I wouldn't LOVE to have both of them torment me lovingly in that way together, but each of them is shy about that for different reasons.

I make a point of waiting for Maca to step away before I kiss C. I have no need to make him feel competitive. There's no competition in my mind. In fact, I kiss one and I long to kiss the other. I make love to one and I long to make love to the other, doesn't matter which one-I just suddenly want to share all the happy loving feelings with whoever isn't there. I LOVE making love to each of them-they are totally different in bed and I love holding both of them too.

Anyway! Now I will shut up again and watch for replies! :)

[maca]

I'm not sure what it is that C is getting out of this relationship the three of you have... I get that he has family out of it, but if you never have any time together LR then how are you to develop levels of connection and intimacy? Is there no time that Maca can look after your kids so that the two of you can go out, perhaps spend the night together and quickly jump back into your own bed before the kids get up (we do this on nights Mono sleeps over)?

I realize that this "question" arose only recently and also realize that there is a lot going on for the two of you in the way of counseling issues and a child moving in with you, but should this not be the time to sort out some logistics together for the long haul? I guess I am feeling kinda bad for poor ol C who doesn't seem to have a voice in all this.

Maca, you were saying, "I was looking for rules or ideas of what was an accepted amount of affection in front of the others. What I have learned is that really there are no rules there is just life, love, experience, compassion and self introspect." The point I guess I am trying to make is that you are at where you are at and you can make rules/boundaries up as you go and change them as you go using love, experience, compassion and self introspection.... when the rule isn't working anymore it's time to look at it again.


Wow I read and then reread this post RP..I sighed 4-5 times and then read it once more.

Im at a loss for what to write or think.I have learned to not open my mouth(or type) till I have fully considered and processed all the info available to me.So I will respectivly postpone a response for now. But I will come back to this because I feel this is an important subject in my life at this very moment. Thanks for the 2x4 to the head RP( I think :) )

[GreenGecko]

Okay, so I'm new here, and probobly won't be here often simply because there's no time and I'm really not much into threads and forums, but I figure I should come say a piece or two so that everyone can get a little more introspective on the relationship involving LR,Maca and I. BTW, up to this point I've been refered to as "C". I decided to call myself GreenGecko because of who I feel I represent in the V. Maca doesn't think we're a tryst, and to be honest, I'm not sure about all the def's, but the Gecos pic on my profile (and soon my avatar) explains a lot.

A few years ago, we all went to Hawaii. LR/Maca went first for a week, then I followed with the kids, everyone together for another week. During that time, Maca/I made a lot of progress in our own personal relationship. This is after the affair, and other things. We were also discussing some other... important details involving the future of our relationship as a whole, or rather as a family. Wow... there's actually a lot that hasn't been discussed, that people don't know about this V. Sorry, I'm just now realizing this. Well... During our time in Hawaii, we stopped in this little shop if trinkets, and I came across this wooden carving of thre gecos forming a circle. As soon as I saw it, I knew I had to get it for Maca, because it helped explain our relationships together. LAter on before we left to go back home, I stopped in again and bought it. I kept it for a while, and decided to paint it. The colors represent each of us. Might be hard to tell in the pic, but the carving has two gecos, mouths touching at the top, and another geco below wrapping tails with one, and biting the tail of the other. The one being bitten is the largest of the three, that one seems to be kissing the other, whose tail is wrapped around the one on bottom biting the tail of the large one. SO, in my mind, the large one was red because it represented Maca, the "head" of the family, also (being radically honest here) the one needing the most attention, or having the most needs. Also he's quick tempered and firey, the one that feels he's been burned the most and feels he has the right to burn others because of it. The one he's kissing was obviously LR, I colored her purple because it's her favorite color. She's kissing the red one, so to me they were both equally important because they were loving together and both at the head, or top. The purple one's tail is wrapped around the green one (that's me). LR, from the very begining of our relationship 16 years ago, has always seemed to do better when I'm around, when I'm near, when she can look at me, hear me, feel me. that helps her know she's safe and will be okay doing whatever it is she needs to do/ deal with. The gren one is also biting the red one in the ass (or on the tail) which I have done numerous times over the last decade. Trying my best to help him, trying to help THEM, trying to make him realize there's more than just HIS problems in the world. Trying to get him to pay attention. The preverbial 2x4 to the head.

Only recently has that point been recognized by Maca, and I thank him for that, and I thank you all on this board that have helped him see things clearer and helped him search inside himself to find who he really is.

There's more to the carving, but that's enough for now as my time to type is very near the end for today.

In a nutshell, RP, what I do get out of this relationship is not about sex, or about getting what I'm due. What I get out of it is love. I have been in love with LR for nearly 20 years, I have been by her side, and helped her whenever I could for almost that entire time. Maca is her husband, and I now she loves him as much as she loves me. And needs him as well, and so because of everything we've been through, after the pain and suffering, the efforts, and the laughter and tears, I have come to love Maca too. Entirely different reasons than LR of course, but... this is my family. I feel a purpose in being involved and a duty to protect this family's best interests. Maca feels differently, I know, and there's atill a lot of ground to cover. I'm not all about "what's fair to me" like he is most times, but he's got different insecurities than I do. This family is important and usually my first priority, but I have been commited to LR for half my life, and that will never change.

I am seemingly mono, to her poly, and Maca... well he's not sure where he sits just yet. But I love everyone involved. My loyalty will always be with LR, but Maca and the kids are so important to me as well.

It's been difficult to actually become friends with him because he's usually so defensive and insecure. These last few weeks have been mind boggoling and I'm so proud of him for his efforts and awakenings, but I hope that he can continue to allow us all to be ourselves, and be ourselves TOGETHER.

LR/I get some time together, and over the years, we've found our intamacy in mere moments. Often just a glance, or a blink says so much. There were times that our hearts could hardly stand not being able to have tha intamacy, but we manage. Sometimes it gets physical, but not nearly as often as we'd like, and not nearly as often as anyone might think, including Maca. We've never kissed in front of him, and haven't felt the need. I have no issues (now, but I did for a long time because of my on insecurities) with their sex life, I don't mind at all that they sleep in the same bed every night. Sometimes it's anoying when he keeps calling or texting when LR/I are trying to have a few minutes of just "being" as we refer to it. But we all have our needs.

So, On that note, I'm going to get ready for work. Nice ot meet you all. Red Pepper, Mono, I hear a lot about you and I want to thank you for all your thoughts, they've helped very much for Maca/LR. I'll be back again, till then, have fun!

[redpepper]

Greengeco, your indeed like my Mono! Are you too lost brothers or something?! Wow!

Your post made me tearful as I heard in it what I hear from Mono. LR is a VERY lucky woman as I am! She must be very special to have such love for so many years.

Thank you for the explanation on the gecos. Simply beautiful. What a find when you found that!

Thank you also for the expanation of how it all "works" for you all. I have so much more clarity now as do others I'm sure.

I feel so fortunate for the time Mono and I have together. My husband is very giving and very well grounded. He works very hard on himself and his relationships. He is very even tempered and stays on top of his feelings much more than I am able to. He is dedicated to our "V" working and strives for a balance as do we all. I have had to ask him not to call when I am with Mono and have to be the one that weighs out who's needs should come first depending on what is going on in everyones life. It helps that we only have one child to manouver through all this. Still, as you say, we are family and we stick together.
Thanks for the post. Look forward to hearing more when you can. :)

[LovingRadiance]

RP-now you know why I keep saying "WOW Mono you remind me of C". ;)
Weird huh?
Yes I am very lucky and I know it which is one reason I am trying SO hard to help Maca through all this gently. I didn't handle things well to start out-but I learned a lot since then about myself, about life, about him etc and I'm working hard now to set the stage for a much better future for all of us. :)

[maca]

Im glad you found time to add your thoughts here C. The gecko's was a very cool profile pic and the story behind it was perfect for explaining the situation as it is now. I really didnt like the link of the the 3 of us then but now it has such an obvious showing of commitment and love.

I know Im not the easiest guy to deal with and I know no one like to see me when Im pissed. Things are good between us and getting better everyday.


RP- I understand what you are saying about Me being where I am and who I am and that boundries and rules can change when its right. I think I wont worry so much about moving fast or getting to the "expected place" in my life. So long as LR/ C / and I keep talking and sharing our feelings I think things will fall into place at there own pace.



Peace and Love

[ourquad]

Maca, I was just explaining to someone at our poly meet and greet last night...everyone has to figure out what makes this type of relationship work for them. Once you do, though it is a hard and painful process at times, you are more than proud of the growth that has been accomplished....individually and as a group. Hang in there all of you.

Vol

[MonoVCPHG]

Nice to hear from you Gecko, and take care Maca and LR! You guys are an inspiration :)

[LovingRadiance]

So much time has passed, so many efforts to get things on track have failed.

Right now Maca isn't living with us (obviously). So there are a LOT of technical details that have changed.

But, showing affection is still a slightly difficult one. Much less so than it was 18 months ago. But, still tense.

I wonder, what should I do when Maca IS here... should I be less affectionate with GG, because I don't want to rub it in Maca's face that GG is still living here? Should I just be "normal" so that Maca gets used to it and GG doesn't feel left out? Should I just run and hide whenever they're both around-so I'm not! :)

I don't know sometimes. Emotionally I don't want to make things any harder on any of us than I already have by coming out poly.... but, figuring out WHAT isn't harder, well that's a bitch now isn't it!

[GroundedSpirit]

...............
Sooo.. . Just out of curiousity how do the rest of you address this.

Hey Maca :)

Question............

How does your gut react when you see total strangers getting quite intimate in public ?

Be honest.............

Because it may be that you have a couple different triggers working here and you need to discover what percentage is what and plan your attack accordingly.
It's shocking (to me) how much discomfort there is for many people about public display of affection. Especially in guys who are generally the big consumers of porn. But true affection is different.
Not the place here to try to psychoanalyze the reasoning behind all the discomfort - just sufficient to say it's real and exists so has to be dealt with.

If it's ONLY (or primarily) about LR then you know what you're dealing with. And maybe it will never be 100% comfortable but it's who she is, so best plan is to figure on dealing with it. It's not going away.
And maybe look at it this way......
At LEAST it's real, genuine ! And it's a positive thing.
With all the shit we see around us every day, being witness to a little genuine, positive emotion is not the worst thing that could happen to us - right ?

Dig in a little - see what's what. Try seeing the positive side. Lots of this stuff is little more than choices. We're not just rags flopping in the wind.........we have some control over our emotions and choices - right ?

:)

GS

[MonoVCPHG]

Hey Maca :)

Question............

How does your gut react when you see total strangers getting quite intimate in public ?



I thought I would answer this too cause I find it an interesting question. I could watch strangers have sex all day...but I don't even like watching my friends suck face. I don't normally feel any energy, especially sexual energy, from strangers but friendships open me up to a different level of energy exchange that disturbs me on a primal level. I don't like sharing sexual energy or having anyone else's (except a specific few) touch me. It's not jealousy, it's just disturbing....kinda icky.

[FlameKat]

I thought I would answer this too cause I find it an interesting question. I could watch strangers have sex all day...but I don't even like watching my friends suck face. I don't normally feel any energy, especially sexual energy, from strangers but friendships open me up to a different level of energy exchange that disturbs me on a primal level. I don't like sharing sexual energy or having anyone else's (except a specific few) touch me. It's not jealousy, it's just disturbing....kinda icky.

I find it an intriguing question too, and looking at it from the energy exchange angle as Mono has... very disturbing yes... that said... I don't have a problem with it myself, just a yes with some people and there relative closeness as well as physical proximity to me plays a huge part in the level of 'ickiness'.

for example:if I can hear verbal cues of lovemaking between people I know in the next room... icky... as that cues me to feel the energy flow, and well to be blunt I will end up either frustrated (I ain't getting any action :p) or completely turned off (just didn't need to hear it), watching it - would take it onto a much deeper level of ickiness, as would the closer relationship (to me) of the people involved... whereas across the other side of the house - not a biggie, even across the room can be fine (the degree of affection plays a part here too)

I am however, highly empathic (except when highly stressed and deliberately blocking myself from others) and suspect that others who find it disturbing (whether arousing or shutting down from it) would also be empathic... I could be way off with that though, and of course there are those that would find it disturbing for cultural/moral/other reasons:)

[Penny]

My friends, a couple deeply in love, are very affectionate with each other. This always makes me smile, though one time he was kissing her stomach with loud smoochy noises and I asked him to stop because that was just a little too much. It was the noise that got to me.

I also dislike being in close proximity to people (strangers or otherwise) playing tonsil hockey or dry humping in public.

Generally, I stick to the same kinds of affection with my guys that I would show my daughter. Quick pecks, non-sexual caresses, hand-holding, hugs and casual cuddles, that sort of thing. The exception is kisses hello and goodbye.

Thumper and I tend to peck for hellos and goodbyes, but we part and meet many times a day. T-Rex I see less often, so goodbye kisses in particular tend to linger a bit more.

[Tonberry]

Didn't we have another thread about public affection?
As I think I said here, I'm French and to me kissing is French kissing. For me quick pecks are more of a "parent kissing their kid" kind of thing. So if you say "kissing in public" or "a couple kissing" or things like that, I'll always think of "normal kissing" which for me is French kissing.

I'm specifying that because Penny's post right above mine says "kissing is fine" and later specify French kisses aren't, which is always confusing to read for me as I read it like someone in North America would read "kissing is fine, but not if your lips are touching" (and yes, that's possible, if you kiss each other's cheek for instance).

Anyway, for me, French kissing is, as I said, the normal way to kiss, and something I've done in public, in front of my family (brothers, parents, grandparents) and so on without thinking about it. It's a non-issue in France and I used to see couples French kissing on my way to school or work pretty much every day in the bus or subway. It always puts a smile on my face as it's similar, to me, to hearing them say "I love you" or seeing them hug.

I really need to get used to the fact that it's not the same here. I think the people who were offended when seeing pictures of me kissing my boyfriend would have been less so if it had just been a peck. But giving pecks just isn't natural to me. I know Raga was about pecks a lot, but being given pecks so often made me start giving them more often too and more naturally.
You might wonder why it might be a bad thing, but what I meant is that I would start giving them to my coworkers, my boss, my family members, etc. I always managed to stop before actually giving the peck, but most people were weirded out and I had to explain to them what happened.
It's just not a romantic sign of affection to me, just a sign of affection period. I think the most telling thing is that I would almost-peck females just as well as males, while I'm very straight and might not even want to hold hands with a female unless I knew her extremely well.

[LovingRadiance]

Didn't we have another thread about public affection?

Yes, this one is an old thread, that I brought back up because it remains an unresolved tension in our relationship.

:(

[redpepper]

@tonberry- you can find a thread on affection that I started by doing a tag search for "public affection" :)

[Penny]

I'm specifying that because Penny's post right above mine says "kissing is fine" and later specify French kisses aren't, which is always confusing to read for me as I read it like someone in North America would read "kissing is fine, but not if your lips are touching" (and yes, that's possible, if you kiss each other's cheek for instance)

French kissing in public is not as acceptable here, but when I referred to tonsil hockey, I meant long, really noisy French kissing. It's the loud sloppy noises that bother me personally.

Americans generally don't touch each other as often as people in other countries. We tend to be a bit uptight, insular, and touch deprived.

My tolerance for public affection is on the high side among adults in my area.

[Tonberry]

French kissing in public is not as acceptable here, but when I referred to tonsil hockey, I meant long, really noisy French kissing. It's the loud sloppy noises that bother me personally.

Ah, yes, that I can understand. I always feel that people who are really disturbed by displays of affection can just look away, but the flipside is to keep that option for them (so, not be loud as you can't "listen away", not do it in a crowded place where people can't look away easily if they want to, not do it in the middle of the way, etc)

Americans generally don't touch each other as often as people in other countries. We tend to be a bit uptight, insular, and touch deprived.

I'm not sure that's true. I think it's just in different context. People in the US hug, they call each other by first names and nicknames a lot (including clerks and people on the phone calling you for deals, etc). That doesn't happen in France. Hugging is intimate and for very close relationships, and you call people "sir" or "madam" even if you've known them for yours unless they tell you you can use their first name.
The Internet is one exception where people are more familiar and use the informal "you", but otherwise that's pretty much a no-no.

I know speech isn't the same as touch, so the second part might not seem to address the point, but I just wanted to show that it's just about culture, and different things being okay in different place, in my opinion.

I'm sorry the problem isn't getting better. I don't think I would feel very comfortable having to actively resist being affectionate with a partner. I might be able to tone it down, but it seems my "tone it down" is already most people "too much" here in North America :S
But obviously I'm not being very helpful here... I wish I could help more.

[koifish]

I think you will need and deserve a lot of reassurance. I think you will have less of a problem with their affection when you are reassured and can trust them more.