Can an abusive relationship heal?

[BlackUnicorn]

I debated for a long time where to post this, so mods, feel free to move this if another section strikes you as more appropriate.

So I am basically asking if anyone has experience with a relationship that has had a history of abuse and is no longer abusive? If so, what made you stick? I have struggled for years, am on medication, tried therapy but never got to speak of the real issues, but just last night after another tirade of verbal/emotional abuse via phone realized that as long as the other party is not willing to acknowledge what they do as abusive and willing to seek help, I can't really hope that anything will ever change.

I have tried to read on this non-violent communication stuff, has anyone experience with using that in this or similar contexts? Right now I've decided to distance myself a bit for emotional health reasons, but I do see it will not help things improve.

Am I just kidding myself in thinking that I can somehow break a decade-long pattern of abusive communication? I feel so much compassion for this person because they are so hurt and angry, and the last thing I want to do is to abandon them.

[Mohegan]

I don't have much experience in abusive relationships turning out well. But I do believe anyone can change. But you said it best-they have to acknowledge that what they are doing is abusive, and be willing to seek help and do the work to change.

For now, if they are not willing to do this, it's best you keep your distance and not keep running yourself through this. I understand, believe me maybe all to well, the desire and need to be there for someone who needs you, regardless of that effect on you. But you HAVE to take care of yourself. You can only give so many suggestions and discuss what they are doing to you, so often, before you just have to cut ties.

[BlackUnicorn]

But you HAVE to take care of yourself. You can only give so many suggestions and discuss what they are doing to you, so often, before you just have to cut ties.

Thank you for your words, Mohegan. It feels good to know I am not the only one whose struggled with the 'just dumb that jerk' -advice.

I find that by cutting off ties I only hurt myself more. That's why I nowadays just prefer to 'take a little break'. I am physically safe and can turn off the phone when I really am not in the mood for listening to rants. I think this change of paradigm from 'we (I) can fix this' to 'it is what it is, I made my choices years ago and now it's just a question of management' that I am experiencing.

Somewhat sad, actually.

[Tracey]

First, I agree wholeheartedly with Mohegan -- you must take care of YOU, because in the end, no one else will. Be sure to put YOU first, at least for awhile.

It appears you've got two dynamics going on: (1) verbal/emotional abuse, and (2) a deeply ingrained, well-developed script. I hold out hope that people can change their behaviors, if the choose to do so. What's really tough to battle is that script. If this has been going on for 10 years, the two of you have a shared pattern of behaviors/responses -- your script -- that you both need to work on together. Your partner says/does something, a trigger, and you KNOW you're about to get blasted. You, in turn, react in some way that causes a trigger for your partner to activate, and before you both know it you're down some ugly path that neither of you can seem to step away from until it's run its course.

I was in a relationship for 29 years that did this very thing. I tried to get my husband to work with me on this, but in his view, there was nothing wrong with him and I was the one who needed help. When I finally left, he lamented to all who would listen that I never gave him a chance. Well, yes I did, and multiple times. But that chance was predicated on his accepting his role and responsibility in this mess, which he refused to do. I couldn't allow myself to be belittled and emotionally battered any longer -- I did what I needed to do to preserve my health, and I left. To this day (5 years later) he still doesn't get it, but it's not my problem. And that is a liberating thought!

When you can, when you're healthier and stronger, do try to step back a bit and look at your dynamic with a critical eye. While you feel compassion toward your partner, what about compassion for yourself? Do the two of you share an unhealthy script that needs to be rewritten? And are you both willing and able to revise that script? If one of you is not, is it time to put the script on the shelf and go in another direction in the writing of your life?

Sending you warmth and white light.....

Tracey

[NeonKaos]

it was moved to the Fireplace because it's not a topic that is specific to poly relationships. abuse and/or healing can happen in any type of relationship.

Carry on folks...

[Carma]

There are times when certain people in my life are simply too emotionally expensive for me. I can't afford to deal with them. When I'm feeling stronger, I can.

It's ok to take protective measures to keep your sanity. You don't have to swirl, just because someone else is.

[BlackUnicorn]

It appears you've got two dynamics going on: (1) verbal/emotional abuse, and (2) a deeply ingrained, well-developed script. I hold out hope that people can change their behaviors, if the choose to do so. What's really tough to battle is that script. If this has been going on for 10 years, the two of you have a shared pattern of behaviors/responses -- your script -- that you both need to work on together. Your partner says/does something, a trigger, and you KNOW you're about to get blasted. You, in turn, react in some way that causes a trigger for your partner to activate, and before you both know it you're down some ugly path that neither of you can seem to step away from until it's run its course.

Yep, I can totally see this. The relationship has been physically violent before and is no longer, so maybe that is why I'm holding out hope for improvement on the emotional level as well? Right now I am a bit pessimistic, though.

Thank you for your kind and insightful words, Tracey!

it was moved to the Fireplace because it's not a topic that is specific to poly relationships.

Thanks!

[ray]

This is a topic that's been on my mind as well. When to stay and work it out versus creating space so that you can take care of yourself. And how much space? Is it temporary or permanent?

I have a pattern of getting myself into relationships/friendships that are some what emotionally unhealthy/sometimes abusive. I'm at the point where I am asking what do I need to be doing so I don't keep ending up in this situation. Therapy is helping with that, I guess.

In my currently situation, I'm feeling like no matter what I say or will say, he's still going to perceive that he's done little wrong. How can I be close to some one who can't even acknowledge deeply hurting someone and treating them cruelly? On the other hand, it pains me greatly to think that I will need to attend things that he is present and will ignore him or be distant. And I still feel vulnerable to manipulation.

I hope that in the future he and I can have a better understanding but I honestly don't have much hope for him to change. Some people don't want to change because it's difficult, or worse, they believe they're wonderful and don't need to change.

I guess that if some one decides to be a 'lost cause,' there's not much point in letting yourself become one too. So easy to say but so hard to do... Sigh...

[opalescent]

The relationship has been physically violent before and is no longer, so maybe that is why I'm holding out hope for improvement on the emotional level as well?

I'm glad the relationship has moved away from physical violence. How did that happen? Did he realize he had a problem and addressed it or did you insist he change?

I'm also curious - why do you feel it would not be a good idea to cut ties and move on?

I ask because the quote above strikes me as worrisome. I've spoken to people who have left abusive relationships and many times they say it was the mental, emotional abuse that left the longest lasting, most profound damage. Please be very, very careful with your mind and your emotions. These are precious and fragile and you deserve someone who treats them with the utmost respect and love.

[Morningglory629]

It's ok to take protective measures to keep your sanity. You don't have to swirl, just because someone else is.

Good suggestions here.

Of course people can change. But that means everyone in that abusive dynamic needs to change. What's the goal? Healthy relationship, right?! There are two people contributing to the dysfunctional behavior patterns.

Get help for you and the rest will happen.

Best of luck BU. You are not alone in dealing with a loved one that needs help with anger or communication problems. We all have in some sense had to deal with it.;)

[BlackUnicorn]

I'm glad the relationship has moved away from physical violence. How did that happen? Did he realize he had a problem and addressed it or did you insist he change?

I'm also curious - why do you feel it would not be a good idea to cut ties and move on?

Get help for you and the rest will happen.

Thanks everyone!

I think I will seek therapy again and this time talk about the real reasons behind my PTSD. Opalescent, I think the worst damage has already been done in that I am taking medication to control my anxiety issues for the foreseeable future at least. I hope that through talking therapy I might be able to cut down the dosage at some point.

Yesterday was personally liberating for me because while this person called me two times while I was out on a date, I just texted back 'Will call you later', whereas before I would have picked up the phone and called to prevent them lashing out.

I think the main reason behind the physical abuse stopping was me telling them that they have no right to touch me without my permission and if they do, I will report them to the police. Once when they tried to stop me from leaving the apartment I called 911 and I think that was really a moment of clarity for them that I was not kidding.

I am skeptical of cutting ties completely because I have tried that before and it didn't work. Our lives are so intimately woven together that it would feel like cutting of an arm and leaving it behind. I understand that sometimes you need to cut off the arm to keep the rest of the body from getting diseased, but I hope we are not at that point yet.

I think I am also a bit pessimistic because when I tried to seek help for the physical abuse before, I was told that I could not stay in the shelter for longer than a week and that they would only offer reconciliation services instead of helping me get my own apartment or what not. So maybe I have a case of learned helplessness?

But thanks again, you guys really made me see that I should reconsider therapy.

[Hades36]

Although it may sound selfish, I have a really easy time of letting people go who consistently cause me pain - no matter who they are. Family, friends, lovers, children - whoever. My theory is that, if you're causing me pain, even if I love you with all my heart, then I have to get away from you because I'm no longer into martyrdom. Did that with my first wife and got me nowhere except screwed up emotionally, financially, and spiritually for several years - and that relationship was only 2 years long!

I admire people who can hang in there but I know that, for myself, after the pain and abuse reach a tipping point then I am gone - not interested in healing or making amends or building bridges. In fact, I usually nuke the bridge as I'm leaving just to make sure I don't go back over it.

[Carma]

Susan Forward has a great book: Emotional Blackmail. Helped me immensely when dealing with emotional abuse. She points out that people use FOG to manipulate us:
Fear
Obligation
Guilt

The book helped me to recognize when it is happening and effective tools to use to stop it.

[girlpatrol]

Unfortunately for the relationships, and fortunately for my sanity, I've left abusive relationships in the past. Now, I do not suffer them well. Emotional abuse is a little harder for me to get my head around, because it deals directly with the matters of the heart, but through experience of being a survivor, I have developed the ability to sever ties pretty ruthlessly. Some call it being cold, but I call it being responsible for my own.

It is what it is. You hurt me, I walk away. You don't get a second chance.

I try not to judge others who are unwilling or unable to walk away from abusive relationships. God knows I have been there and I have known what it felt like to hope against hope things would change.

[BlackUnicorn]

Thank you for the book tip, I will pick it up once my study subsidiary materializes again next month!

This morning they phoned me 24 times, so it was not a great day for distancing myself. But I feel that having so much love in my life as a result of poly and just general opening up my heart for love, I have more stamina for dealing with my more difficult loves, too.

[River]

I'll contribute just one little thing, since others have offered so much already.

I continually remind myself that how anyone I'm involved with treats me ... is how I'm treating myself. This way I accept my responsibility for sticking around.

The thought helps me to recognize when I'm being mistreated, and that I have the option of not being mistreated. And it helps me see what power I have to choose.

I do not accept mistreatment or abuse. It's simply not acceptable. Yet it will happen now and then, and I have to decide if it is a pattern or just the result of someone having a difficult moment.

[redpepper]

I missed this thread the first go around... shoot. Anyway, I wanted to direct you to the thread I started some time back, in case there is some relevance. http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6019

[marksbabygirl]

Short answer - but only if the abuser wants to change.

Long answer - habits and ways of interacting are fairly ingrained and changes will be slow and sometimes painful. The pain of being abusive has to outweigh the pain of changing the abusive behaviour for it to take effect.

I have seen it happen though - it took 14 years of a good friend of mine crying herself to sleep every night before her husband actually changed.

He's pretty good now :)

[BlackUnicorn]

Thanks RP, I will delve into that thread soon-ish!

Thanks to everyone else whose posted, too! I want everyone to know that sharing this has really helped me to stand up for myself. We are now back together on the provision that if the name-calling and bullying starts again, I leave.

[bella123456]

I admire people who can hang in there but I know that, for myself, after the pain and abuse reach a tipping point then I am gone - not interested in healing or making amends or building bridges. In fact, I usually nuke the bridge as I'm leaving just to make sure I don't go back over it.

Classic piece of advice !

[Hades36]

I worked at an abuse shelter as a security guard, my mother was a counselor at the same shelter, and I saw and heard things that, even while I'm writing this response, made me want to vomit scorpions. Unicorn, I wish you the best.

[rory]

I have suffered (mostly) emotional abuse with my "mother" (i.e. my dad's wife who was in my life since I was 5). It was the worst right before I moved out, I was afraid of her at that point. It felt so normal it took me years to even see it as abuse. I notice that I still tend to downplay it because there were only few minor incidents on physical abuse.

Once I have started to realise that my experiences were indeed abuse, I have decided never again to take it. As a child, I couldn't do anything about it but now I can. My life, my freedom and my happiness are way too big prices to pay. I have promised myself to walk away and now I'm in a place I think I would spot abuse early and be able to do that. I do realise it is often not easy to do, and usually abusive people are master manipulators.

I do think that if abusive people honestly wish to change it is good for them to have help. But I don't think that the abused person is in the best position to help and they should put their own safety and happiness first.

[Athena]

Most abusers seek help for their behavior only under coercion (usually legal coercion). Keep yourself safe and keep your distance rather than hoping to bring change about by yourself.

[Morningglory629]

Good point Athena.

[BlackUnicorn]

It was the worst right before I moved out, I was afraid of her at that point. It felt so normal it took me years to even see it as abuse. I notice that I still tend to downplay it because there were only few minor incidents on physical abuse.

My situation is very similar. And I think it's so freaky we need to even paraphrase our experiences with 'only' or 'just', but that is how I think, too. REAL abuse is about visits to the ER and broken bones, not about constantly feeling bad and afraid.

[rory]

I totally agree that it is horrible for the perception of violence to become that it is so normal that you would say only. It's absurd and yet so hard to change. Rationally, I do recognise what happened as violence nowadays. But still when someone talks about "domestic violence" I instantly think about all the poor children of drunk fathers (or something to that effect). I don't usually come to think about my own childhood. Even though that's what it was.

[auroralea2003]

I am currently in an abusive relationship. It has been physical, but due to incarceration etc. this person is now only emotionally and verbally abusive.
It's all about control. This person is controlling you through the phone. I have been reading site after site and horrific story after another. This person doesn't have to change at all because you are allowing him in. You feel sorry for him. It's codependency. I'm not accusing you of anything accept being a caring and understanding individual. I am that person. I see my mate as broken and in need of my support. He literally makes me crazy with his accusations of cheating and constant questioning of my every move. Abuse is all about control. I consider myself a martyr for staying in this relationship. Everyone I have read or spoken to says that cutting off the relationship(move, change number) was the best and most liberating move they ever made. I only hope that I can have the courage to keep this guy moved out next time I kick him out. You have to realize you are in control and responsible only for you. You are important and your happiness is important. Just like some of the people who spend their lives in and out of jail changing is not easy. And some people do not have the skills, opportunity or intelligence to change. Good Luck, he will survive without you. you don't have to be a victim and you don't have to suffer for someone's psychological issues. Not everyone is a fixer upper that can be fixed. cheers.

[Tonberry]

I consider myself a martyr for staying in this relationship.

Don't. Absolutely don't. Staying isn't helping anyone. It's not helping you, it's not helping them. Listen, I have been in abusive relationships from both sides, I have been abused and I have abused. Someone who lets you abuse them is not helping you. It doesn't make you happy. It makes you feel miserable and you lose respect for yourself and for them a bit more every time, and yet you don't know of another way to deal with one another, and when you stop they are so used to being abused that they act to provoke it again because it reassures them.
And at some point you feel like it's what you're expected to do, whether it's true or complete crap. And someone staying does not make it less so. Someone staying makes it feel like they're staying because they want things to be that way, and if you stop being abusive, they might leave you.

You need to stand up for yourself and leave. And if a relationship ever shows the signs of going that way, stand up for yourself right away, stop the vicious circle before it starts, establish a clear line.
But now it's too late for that. The only thing that can help them at that point is losing you. And maybe next time they won't start the cycle again, or they'll find someone who won't take any crap from them. But right now, the best way to help yourself, and the best way to help them, is to go the hell away.

It's not just liberating for the person who is abused to get away from the relationship. It's liberating for the abuser, too. There is something wonderful about not being an abuser anymore. There is something wonderful about dealing with people who stand up for themselves, people you can consider your equals.
I don't know how many abusers are at a stage when they can take a look at themselves and stop, but what I know is that it's hard to do while in a relationship, and I assume it would be much easier while not in one, so on top of saving yourself (which you really need to, and then work and rebuilding yourself, your self confidence, your self respect, and know that you are good and worthy and can do it all), you might be saving them, too.
Yes, they need help. But the only way you can personally help them at this point is by not being there for them to abuse.

Good luck. It's hard and requires you to be brave, but you can do it. You are not a martyr, because martyrs sacrifice themselves for a cause. There is no cause, so you are just sacrificing yourself. For nothing. You're committing suicide by staying. Get away.