Walking a new path...

[marksbabygirl]

After much discussion... some of it good discussion, some of it attacking/hurtful discussion.... Dh asked me today if I wanted to open up our relationship.

The smart-assed brat in me wanted to respond with "DUH"

Instead, I simply said "Yes, I would like to be able to explore possibilities that present themselves"

Funnily enough - there was a moment of "EEP" when he said HE was interested in exploring - but I understand where it comes from and can work through it. There are some insecurities on my part, but I know those are MY insecurities - and that as long as we continue to converse, and talk about the things that are important to us, we'll continue to grow together.

We have, at this point, set one major boundary.... our D/bg relationship will be OURS... no one gets that but me :-)

Its an interesting journey we'll be taking... :D

[foxflame88]

Good luck. (I would have wanted to respond with DUH too.)

[marksbabygirl]

Thanks!

We've experience an "open" relationship before -we were into swinging for quite some time.... so the discussions and negotiations are familiar territory - there's just a few new issues that we need to work around that have come up in the last few years... :cool:

It makes it ... interesting :-)

[Ariakas]

Congrat MBG. Thats a good step. You have support up here if you wanna chat :) It was a pleasure meeting you both this weekend. We had a blast. :)

[marksbabygirl]

Thanks Ari...

The conversation came about partly because of last night - he had a great time last night as well as did I.

Its going to be an interesting road... now to reign in my initial reaction to jump in the deep end with no life jacket... *snicker* :p

[marksbabygirl]

still enjoying the path I'm walking on...

Talking to a number of people.... maintaining my "friends first" stance even though its oh-so-fucking-hard.... I'm a jump into the deep end of the pool and then see if I can swim type person. But this is important to me... its not just me to think about - its also my dh and my kids and I don't want them to get hurt.

In my head - anyone who comes into my life will be involved in my kids' lives and so I need to know that they are solid - that they are someone I want my kids hanging around.

I have been chatting with the him of a couple different couples - I'd like to chat with the her too -but for whatever reasons - we're not connecting as quickly.

I've been chatting with a single woman - she's great

I"ve been chatting with the her of a couple - she's great too - however right now she's hurting and I'm in "mama-bear-rescue" mode - I have a tendency to do that :p

Its been fun :D I'm enjoying myself immensely and to my dh's delight - I'm not obsessing over anything or taking an enormous amount of time away from my family.... who knows what will happen when I actually enter into a relationship :p

I'm having fun :D

[bimblynim]

yay! good luck!

[marksbabygirl]

Still walking the path together....

Enjoying the journey and ironically - he's getting more attention than me. :p

I think its great :D

[marksbabygirl]

Had a conversation with someone the other day. Apparently the "typical" scenario goes something like this:

Man wants open/poly relationship.
Woman agrees (regardless of how that came about or how grudgingly)
Woman gets all the attention.

I've also (through reading this forum) seen the following:

Man wants open/poly relationship
Woman agrees (regardless again of the how)
Man has a new spouse.


SO not being typical - my story started out like this:

WOMAN wants open/poly relationship
Man finally agreed after MUCH conversation and assurances from woman.
Man finds someone he connects with.

Really? Can't I just do ONE thing normally???? LMFAO

He or she is out there -and I am THRILLED for dh that he's found someone he's connected with so well.

My life is a mass of contradictions and this is the latest irony :p

[marksbabygirl]

I'm in pain, he's hurting because I'm in pain but I don't want him to have to deal with my pain because he's going through some amazingly good feelings and NRE. I'm thrilled for him.

I'm angry and hurting and pissed off and I don't know how to effectively express that - it has NOTHING to do with him or the relationship he's developing.

But I find myself making snarky remarks about it all - and that's not fair to him, because he's going through some really awesome stuff.

I don't know how to get my needs met without hurting other people right now. I'm effectively shutting things down and stuffing it behind walls. Someone hurt me, through thoughtlessness and insensitivity and I have yet to talk to this person, but it hurts M to see me in such pain.

I don't want him to hurt because I'm hurting, so I hide it.

Stupid fucking circle. I hate it.

[Mohegan]

I know that circle well. I don't know how your relationship works, but for Karma and I we have learned we HAVE to talk to eachother no matter what the other is experiencing. Because if we don't, the pain and concern and wondering that comes with not knowing, takes from the other things in our lives. So we end up doing more harm than good by stuffing it all inside.

I hope you find a way through. Feel free to PM if you want to talk.

[marksbabygirl]

Thanks, email sent

[marksbabygirl]

Yesterday was so very freaking miserable and at the same time turned out to be so wonderful by this morning.

Dh is retired (young - he raises our children) and his new lady is home a lot as well. They get a lot of time to communicate. I may or may not get time to communicate with him during my work day depending on my work day, how much work I have to do and how busy my office is (after this I'm pretty much offline until I clear my desk - I think you may see me resurface around 4pm)

So at dinner - she texts him. Something sweet and lovely and designed to bring his attention and focus right back to her. Overall - I don't mind those texts - afterall - without that kind of communication - you don't build a loving romantic relationship. And she's my friend. So I'm really happy for both of them.

At any rate - something snapped. I said in a really nasty, sarcastic tone "Does she really think that THIS is an appropriate time to be texting that to you???"

Which started a motherloving fight.

He accused me of being jealous - I kept reiterating that I was MAD because it wasn't an appropriate time for that - not that I was jealous of it - but because she gets ALL DAY with him and I don't.

Yeah - I recognize now - with the help of a couple friends - that its jealousy - but not of the text or of her, per se.

He said some things to me which made me see red - really - he should know better than to push THOSE particular buttons - and we ended up retreating into strained silence. He managed to calm down, apologised to me for how he reacted to me and I, well I don't calm down as fast... and I stayed mad-ish. Silent. Irritated.

We went for a family walk. Did some talking. I gave him some things to think about - and since I get emails on my phone - I received some things to think about. I had hoped we would be able to talk more after the boys went to bed.

My brother and his wife were at our house when we got home. They stayed, chatting until 11pm. I go to bed between 10.30 and 11pm usually. Lately life hasn't been usual.

So they left and there was this ... distance between us. A horrible stressful uncomfortable distance.

I talked to him. Told me what I needed from him. He agreed. He said he would. And he continued to give lip service to it.

I asked him a very pointed question - to which he had a small lightbulb go off. Not that he changed his actions.

We went to bed, I was still feeling frustrated and that my needs were going to continue to go unmet - but I didn't want to be a nag.

I came out of the bathroom and explained to him how I understood those posts where the spouse is frustrated by the g/f or oso getting the romance and lovely gestures without having to ask, nag or do anything but be.... and she's just getting the day to day bills, the mundane, the crap and NOT getting the romance despite asking for it.

I told him that yeah, I was jealous. I was jealous because I REMEMBER that strong confident sexxy man who pulled me close and kissed me our first "date" when I first walked into the room - and how I MISSED that. I NEEDED that. I wasn't jealous because she's getting it, I'm jealous because she's getting it just for BEING and I have to beg for it.

He says he hears me. I said that I wasn't trying to hurt him, but he's been saying that all f'ing night. He says he's had an "aha" moment and that he GETS it. I said again... I'd been hearing it all night and that I will believe it when I see it.

And I have been seeing it. Last night, this morning, its been wonderful. I made a concious choice to do something I hadn't been doing in a while and I'm sure that contributed. Its not all him - I need to do some of the work too. But its been amazing for the last 10 hours.

I know we can work through this. He's my love - our 11th anniversary is on Saturday. We've been together for 12.5 years now. I hope... that this isn't a momentary blip.

But for now, I'm amazingly happy, not feeling insecure, not feeling afraid, and just loving him...

[foxflame88]

Sometimes we must endure the struggles to appreciate the triumphs. ((hugs))

[Ariakas]

Thanks for posting.

Might I make a couple of suggestions.

1 - Text her, you are friends with her and ask her to give you guys time. She likely doesn't know its a bad time ;)...her and I work and live different eating schedules for example. So we can have bad habits of communicating at different times. Late at night, mid way through dinner :p
2 - I don't think it is wrong of you to want time MBG. It may be rooted in jealousy but you still need time to connect with wellington nightly, I know I need that with Pengrah. Instead of bottling it up and exploding, maybe you should make up clear time frames and rules on your time to keep you comfortable.

Just some thoughts.

[marksbabygirl]

Thanks for posting Ari.

I texted her about 10 minutes before you posted - I want to connect with her because she IS my friend as are you. And I know, or at least am coming to know that its OK for me to say "hey - this is what I need, how can we all work together to make sure no one is feeling left out here?"

There's a lot more to it - but I think it paid a large part in my meltdown on Sunday/Monday that I didn't feel like I was "allowed" to express my needs during "their" time. (all totally in my head - really I get in my own head and I am behind enemy lines)

This is a steep learning curve for me. And its not necessarily fun lessons for me but I understand that if its going to work for Wellington and I - I NEED to learn these lessons.

I thought the path was clear, maybe a few peices of deadfall I'd have to work through to go on this journey. Didn't realize I had so much underbrush I'd have to clear before being able to walk comfortably. :eek: :p

[Ariakas]

I figured something like that was up and have mentioned it to her as well...btw.

That's the big weakness in texting. They may seem like they are spending a buttastic amount of time talking but they aren't. Considering how slow they both type, I bet they barely get through a full page of conversation ;)...it really isn't much in the scheme of things

[Magdlyn]

Ooohhh... is this what I suspected? Marksbaby's husband has hooked up with Ari's wife?

[Ariakas]

Ooohhh... is this what I suspected? Marksbaby's husband has hooked up with Ari's wife?

They are meeting and getting along great :)

[Magdlyn]

My spidey senses were really tingling about that.

[marksbabygirl]

I hate this. I hate the fucking up and down emotional roller coaster.

I had plans for tonight. I had a great chat with Pengrah about her and her relationship with Wellington and so as I was getting ready to leave I texted her with "Are you available if he needs you?"

I was ok. I was comfortable in knowing that he had somewhere to turn if he needed to.

And on the way home I'm full of tears. I had fun where I was - but it was like having cookies. They taste good - but are not very nourishing.

I wanted poly because I needed/wanted more.

Now - my dh has someone he's crushing on - and while he's with me - he's WITH me - but I have less - because how much of his time is spent thinking about her, looking forward to being with her... yanno, all that wonderful NRE stuff? But I don't have it.

And then there's the issue that left me feeling so horrible on Sunday night/Monday morning. That issue continues to leave me feeling stigmatized and less than. I don't know how to move past it.

For 3 days now - I"ve had nothing but heavy, intense conversations. Very little fun, light, friendly conversations and I watch everyone around me having those.

So to sum it up, right now....

1. I feel stigmatized. Don't know how to get past that.
2. I am slightly lonely - because not only do I not have another partner, I don't have my husbands full attention either.
3. I need fun. And from those who matter to me most - I'm not getting it.

UGH.

[marksbabygirl]

I am behind enemy lines right now.

Stuck in my head and what ifs.

I want to go back a while and unhave a conversation.

I guess this is where karma is biting me in the ass..

[Magdlyn]

It'll get better, MBG!

[marksbabygirl]

Feeling "off" today.

I had an amazing experience with dh and our play date last night - then we all tumbled into bed and I misunderstood something - there was a lack of communication and I felt once again left out.

Woke up this morning, had a conversation with him about it - and we cleared it up, sorta. His perceptions are different than my perceptions so... BLAH.

Realized today that 13 years ago, I met him - he was with his c/l wife of 12-ish years at that time.

We got together in Feb of 1998 - and 2 weeks after we got together he left his common law wife of 13 years for the woman he was sleeping with.... ME.

Now - he's 12 1/2 years into a relationship with me (married 11 tomorrow!!) and I wonder... does the TIMING off all this have anything to do with my inability to handle this well?

Ah well - I'm not losing my mind today - and I've managed to express my discomfort with something in a healthy way - although he took it defensively... *sigh* gotta love texting as a way of communication :cool:

Tonight is girls night out - tomorrow is my anniversary :D My mom is coming to hang out with us, and my daughter will be there on Sunday. Sunday night I'm supposed to go see Terri Clark in concert. Overall, a REALLY great weekend starting in 10 minutes when my friend picks me up for lunch :p

[MonoVCPHG]

Terri Clark in concert. :p

I don't listen to country but she has a house in my old neighborhood. There was a silent auction there and her hat went for $1300! Crazeeeee..it was my friend bidding on it with her bosses money LOL!

[marksbabygirl]

Today is our 11th anniversary.

I woke up from a horrific dream where my husband and I had travelled along distance with our children to visit his family and long time friends. I thought everything was going great, when they all went into a meeting.

When they came out, hubby took me aside and said "this is what's wrong with you. Please change this. I love you and will help you change"

I broke down in tears - crying that I hated this place, I wanted to go home. He stroked my head and held me and said VERY lovingly "I know you do hun. Just make the changes and you'll be happy again"

NOT a good dream.

We had a HUGE fight last night - although by the end of it realized that the fights are shorter, and resolved quicker. If nothing else good happens out of this journey - our communication skills are becoming phenomenal and that will only serve to strengthen us and our marriage.

Get the fight done, we're both ok at the end of it. I go out and get rather drunk. (it was a planned night out with a friend -including the getting drunk part LOL) I get home and we have some REALLY good conversation.

He tells me that the girl we play with casually - he doesn't want to do anything beyond BDSM play with her. I'm in agreeance - now we just have to find a way to tell her -it really has nothing to do with her - but we'd like to still be friends - we enjoy her company.

I asked for a couple things with regards to his relationship that he's going on. Probably not the best timing to ask - but it was on my mind and I needed to get it out. We'll discuss it further as my questions were more of a generality and I need to get some specifics nailed down. But not today :) And I'm pretty freaking ok with that :D Normally I would be pushing for conversation NOW because its swirling around in my head. But I'm good with that :)

We have a full day planned. Shopping, farmers market and my mom will be here later. I want to take the boys "somewhere" for fun hiking/climbing stuff - but as I just watched dh take his pain meds (he has Tramacet he has for when his pain days are REALLY bad) if I want to spend the day with dh, I will have to forgo that. We'll find something fun to do at home I think... :)

Everything is good. Its great. I feel incredibly connected to my husband - and am just really happy today :D

[Magdlyn]

Oh wow MBG, I am so glad you are making some progress with W! For some reason I thought you were going camping w Ari and Repepper et al!

I'm glad you and he had some time for sharing playtime with your friend, and had energy and clarity enough to have some good talks as well.

[marksbabygirl]

I was invited to camping, and if it were just about any other weekend but this one - we probably would have gone.

Sometime in the next couple of days - we are going to have a conversation about what poly means to us, how we want it to look and find the boundaries that we're comfortable with.

I am in a weird sort of space. I think about dating and I wonder how I'll have the energy. Or time. And really... why....? I'd have to get used to someone else's quirks, personality....

Its a really good day for me. I put myself out there on OK Cupid last night - I'll see if I make any connections. If I do, I'll see where they lead - but if I don't... for now, today, I'm ok with that :)

[MonoVCPHG]

I'm missing you :( next time!

[marksbabygirl]

Awwww you're so sweet :D

I'm having a wonderful awesome amazing day with my husband :D

We'll definately connect... hopefully sometime this year!! :D

[marksbabygirl]

I meant to relate a story of something that happened on Thursday night.

I was catching a ride from work to home with a friend so my usual ride left without me. She was running late - so I arranged to meet Ari for a drink before she got there.

I get my co-workers to drive me over.

We pull in - and they ask me who I'm meeting - I tell them and they jokingly say "ohhhhh stepping out on your husband eh?"

I say "No, actually my husband is sleeping with his wife"

WHAT??!?!?!?

I clarify - "Well actually they're not sleeping together yet - but they are seeing each other"

OMG.... I laughed SO hard when I got out of the car... it was FUN :D

There's a saying "Don't scare the vanilla's" Well, I couldn't help but scare them, just a little ;)

[Magdlyn]

"Comfort the disturbed
Disturb the comfortable"

That's my motto!

[marksbabygirl]

"Comfort the disturbed
Disturb the comfortable"

*snicker*

I LOVE IT!!!

[Majikdancer]

[QUOTE=Magdlyn;41233]"Comfort the disturbed
Disturb the comfortable"

I love that. Who said it? Can I use it?

[Mohegan]

Karma and I get great pleasure from taking people out their box. It's a favored past time of ours. I love watching faces as they put the pieces together.

[Magdlyn]

"Comfort the disturbed
Disturb the comfortable"

I love that. Who said it? Can I use it?

I didnt know who said it, and had to look it up. It was the title of a 1997 book. A version first appeared 100 yrs ago, in a newspaper article, as, "comfort the afflicted, afflict the comfortable."

I guess it's up for grabs! Go for it.

[marksbabygirl]

My dog escaped our yard last night sometime between 1am and 6.30am.

We had put him out for his evening - and then he went after a skunk. Skunk vs dog - skunk wins every time.

It was late, so the decision was made to leave him out for the evening.

I got a phone call at 6.30am by my neighbour - he had escaped.

W went and got him and came back MAD. That's it, he's DONE with the damn dog escaping and doing stuff (that dogs do) and seriously contemplating re-homing him.

And that's when I realized where a major source of my stress comes from.

I told him I needed him to NOT threaten to get rid of the dog every time the dog does something annoyingly dog-like. The dog can't help it. He is just behaving the way he is supposed to. He can't control his instincts.

For a long time in our marriage, we were really volatile. The word divorce was yelled by both parties - the very real threat of ending it because the other was pissed off and didn't want to deal with the behaviour, attitude, fighting, whathaveyou anymore. It stopped 2 years ago when he broke me.

We had been building an amazing wonderful D/s relationship and he threw that word at me again. I had opened myself up to him in ways that I didn't realize I could - and then he threatened to leave me once again.

At that point I told him that if the word was thrown out there - he/I had better be prepared for it - because *I* would make it happen. End of story. My children are not going to grow up wondering if their parents are going to work through shit or if they're going to seperate or what.

We have done a lot of work on our relationship and ourselves in the past 2 years. Regardless of the volatility of our relationship - we always came back together and closer each time. We both brought baggage and issues to our marriage - but the last two years have been awesome/amazing.

Since W started seeing Pengrah, I have lost my mind. I don't know how to handle these emotions (although I'm getting much better) and there have been a LOT of drama/stress filled days and aside from this weekend - not much contentment and peace.

I have been getting amazing support from people on here, from other sites, and from W. But I can't help but freak out... what if I piss him off enough with dealing with this that he's *done* and wants to get rid of the problem?

I realized, with that - that I had been doing the same to him - more than a few times I'd asked him... what if I can't handle it and I ask you to end it? He kept re-assuring me that he would - but I realized that its not what *I* want. I enjoy (when I'm not totally insane about it) the smiles and giggles and great energy he gets from talking to Pengrah. I enjoy his connection with her - because the energy spills over to me. We've had a PHENOMENAL connection when I'm not fucking it up and losing my mind. But my emotions have been out of control because I feel like no one will ever want me.

Everyone I have met recently that I have been interested in has either been NOT interested in me - or interested in my husband only.

I work full time. I put priority on family time. I have other things that I need/want to do as well... when the fuck am I going to have time to date?

So I, in my own insecurity about me and my abilities to attract a potential partner - have threatened his blossoming relationship - and that's not fair to him OR her.

Some very good things have come out of the past weekend. We're both on board that we don't want casual relationships - friendships, yes, but for both of us, we're the long term sort, and sex is kinda tied up in that.

Its been said on these boards a number of times - go at the pace of the person having the most difficulty. So with great trepidation - I made some requests that will slow things down on their end. I feel *somewhat* bad about it - but really - I know my husband would end it if I asked - and if Pengrah isn't ok with the slow down - that tells me that she wouldn't respect our relationship (and as an aside - I totally think she'll be on board with it - she's a very lovely woman) but I need things to slow down. I need there to be some boundaries and *rules* until *I* am comfortable - they need to be there. I don't want/can't have a repeat of last week. I need the rollercoaster to stop.

Its getting better. Made it through the weekend with minimal stress. Most of it manifests itself in panick attacks and upset tummy - but that's been going away quickly.

Its an interesting journey - and one I am still glad I'm on - I just hate the rollercoaster... :rolleyes:

[Wellington]

Thanks for posting all of this. I think that you are very brave for doing so. I can understand your trepidation regarding my being "done" with the dog and how that might translate to you. I will work on making my venting a little less spontaneous and a whole lot more thoughtful. I'll try, lol. Darn red headedness anyways :) I am here for you always, my love. I will keep reminding you of that everyday of my life. I am sorry that you are having so much difficulty, I love you and I will keep reminding you of that everyday of my life as well. I am not going anywhere. Sorry, Babygirl, you're stuck with me ;)

[Mohegan]

Karma and I went through a very recent bout of, "what if you get sick of waiting and leave?" It was honestly what helped me finaly say, okay we can start moving forward again. He's been so understanding and supportive. Even when I had no clue why I was upset. I still don't know why. But I realized as I looked back at the last 8 yrs, he could have had a much easier go at life had he left, and he didn't. So why would he leave when I am trying to give him what he wants and needs?

I'd suggest taking a deep breath, try hard not to dwell (I drove myself into a nasty depression doing that), Keep talking. I'm I sounded like a broken record to Karma, but I kept trying to say the same thing a different way until he got it.

And (not saying he doesn't,not saying he does) there comes a time when you have to leave it for your spouse to prove. Karma doing what he said he was going to do, made a HUGE difference in how I responded to things and how quickly I came around. I dwell on things for years. But having the trust in knowing he heard me, acknowledged my needs and is now doing what I asked made all the difference.

Good luck, and maybe the dog ran away for a "reason". I love finding those things placed in our path that gives us that "Ah ha" moment.

[marksbabygirl]

Yanno when you lance a boil... and everything that comes out is disgusting and toxic and awful? But then its able to heal?

That's how it feels every time I have one of my *moments* All the toxicity, all the poison, is able to come out - the protective cover that allows it to fester has been removed - and then I'm able to heal.

I am so very grateful that he supports me in that - but I am so very sorry about what it costs him. :(

We are heading in a good direction - I just need to heal more.

[Derbylicious]

Yanno when you lance a boil... and everything that comes out is disgusting and toxic and awful? But then its able to heal?

That's how it feels every time I have one of my *moments* All the toxicity, all the poison, is able to come out - the protective cover that allows it to fester has been removed - and then I'm able to heal.

I am so very grateful that he supports me in that - but I am so very sorry about what it costs him. :(

We are heading in a good direction - I just need to heal more.

I just got the mental visual on that :p I get what you mean though. I do the same thing. It takes me a while to get to where I'm going and to figure things out, but once the nasty is out I do heal and get to a good, strong place.

I met Pengrah over the weekend and I have to say from what I know of her so far she seems to be a very open and understanding woman. I don't get the vibe that she's trying to push you into anything that you aren't ready for but rather worried about her own potential heartbreak in the situation. Best of luck to all of you.

-Derby

[marksbabygirl]

If you've been reading my posts - you know I've lost my mind in the last 10 days or so. Its been a hell ride and I couldn't figure out why. I pushed for it, I wanted it, and now that we ARE poly - I turned into this nasty, jealous, irrational woman. :( It has been a hell week and a half for everyone.... Wellington, Pengrah, me, I'm sure Ari has had to deal with some of it - and my kids... my poor kids who haven't been able to sleep and have had tummy aches from the continual stress.

So back ground on me and my relationship with Wellington (did you really have to pick such a long name hun? LOL)

Summer of 2008 - we decided to explore BDSM. Well - more of *I* needed to, and the dynamics of our relationship were such that he wasn't going to be the one to Dominate me. The Dom I connected with was unavailable - and so over that summer, as I waited... I ... encouraged .... W to play with me. We discovered that yes, this really worked for us. We played around with various roles and based on my needs and his proclivities, we came to the Daddy/babygirl roles in our D/s relationship.

This is not ageplay for us. It is more of a safe harbour for me. I am, in my daily life, very strong, independent, in control, and in charge. Especially after his heart attacks - I kept walls up - I must be strong, I must be the rock I must be the one everyone can lean on.

In the Daddy/babygirl relationship - I am fragile, I am safe, I am vulnerable, I am able to lean on him. I trust him to take care of me, to keep my best interests at heart, and to do what's best. I trust him to not hurt me or leave me hurting.

Plus there's a lot of really fun hurty play that excites me :D

Then I pushed for poly. And he met a very special, lovely woman who he has an amazing connection with. I was excited for it. I suggested that he invite her down to our house, we'd hang out for a bit then the two of them could go downstairs to the family room, have some snuggle time, some get to know you time, sorta 'date' time. I fully expected and suggested that he would spend the night in the spare room with her. (non-sexually) I was truely excited and happy for them, and hoping to find my own connection... all connections I had made to this point were at the 'friendship' level.

Sunday night comes. She's heading back from a visit with her sister, and it seems *perfect* for her to stop in Squamish, hang out, have the visit and then head on to Whistler the next day.

And then there was a conversation to be had. I don't have very high self-esteem right now. And we had a very uncomfortable and awkward conversation about MY health which left me feeling less. I don't feel attractive or wanted or anything and then I felt less. Add to that all the NRE floating around my house. He's all happy and gushy and I feel less. And I do what I need to do to keep my husband happy and stuff the feeling less down - so I sit up all night crying and end up baking chocolate chip cookies at 2am.

The basis of my personality plus our D/s relationship is that I need to please him. I need to make him happy. I didn't feel, at that point, that I had the right or option to change the plans for the night - and so I told him to go to her. And he went. He left me for her.

I lost my mind. Couldn't figure out why I did. Why did I suddenly become a crazy lady with jealousy and insecurity issues? Why did I need so badly? I made life a living hell for my husband. His blood pressure went up, he developed insomnia - all very BAD things for a cardiac patient. We fought a lot. Our kids suffered.

So last night - we're talking - and it very quickly degenerates into a fight. He leaves to go calm down, I go to have a bath, and we come back together to talk about it. My issue is that I *need* to be ok before Pengrah comes up for a visit tomorrow (today) I need to NOT be in as much pain and we NEED to talk about this - because if I can't get that dealt with - the brutal honesty she wants is going to hurt. And badly. And it might push her away. And my husband will be hurt. And it will be a nasty uncomfortable evening.

So I ask him. What if? What if the pain is too great for me? What if its so VERY painful that I need them to back off to just texts and phone calls?

He gets mad, says I should trust him and I say I don't. He is taken aback. It degenerates into a bit more of a fight.

Finally (and I don't remember how) it comes out that I don't trust him because he left me, in pain and hurting, to go be with her on that first Sunday. I don't trust that he'll keep me safe, that he'll BE there for me, because he wasn't. I don't trust him anymore. HOLY FUCK.

Tears and sadness and all of a sudden we BOTH feel a weight lifted. We know what's happened and why I lost my mind. We both agree that he shouldn't have left me. He should have followed his instincts and stayed with me. He didn't. In his words - he fucked up and now we're all paying for it.

At the end of it all - I told him that I didn't feel I had the right to cancel Pengrah's visit. I felt like I was stuck with it because I had agreed to it. Also that I didn't know if I could handle it and I KNEW I couldn't handle the heavy "conversations" that she wanted to have with me because the issue isn't, and never has been between her and I. I like her. I think she's great for my husband and I know she has a primary relationship and doesn't want to "steal" him from me. The issue is one of trust between Wellington and I. I need to be able to trust him and I don't.

So I told him that I was leaving it in his hands, that he would have to make the decision (no hidden agendas, no testing him) about her visit.

He made his decision, Pengrah is at my house today, and I am looking forward to the evening with both of them. Parameters have been set and we'll see where the evening progresses. But for now, I need to trust that he's going to do what's right for US and I don't ... exactly...

Today, though, I'm not feeling all twisty inside. I don't need to know what they're talking about or how they're interacting. That's fucking amazing when I think about the last 10 days.

Things are good. I can see the light. I know the problem, we finally got to the core of it all. We can get through this.

Today, I see a happy future. And my feelings match it :)

[Derbylicious]

Sounds like you learnt the same lesson I did, say what you mean right up front because it causes less hurt feelings and crazy emotions down the line.

[Ariakas]

At the end of it all - I told him that I didn't feel I had the right to cancel Pengrah's visit. I felt like I was stuck with it because I had agreed to it. Also that I didn't know if I could handle it and I KNEW I couldn't handle the heavy "conversations" that she wanted to have with me because the issue isn't, and never has been between her and I. I like her. I think she's great for my husband and I know she has a primary relationship and doesn't want to "steal" him from me. The issue is one of trust between Wellington and I. I need to be able to trust him and I don't.

And this is a problem. She is potentially entering into a relationship with him and you are part of that. You need to be comfortable and have a right to your rules to help you get comfortable with the situation. Remember we are new to this too, we had lots of rules in the beginning, we were just open to renegotiating them whenever they came up. ;)

As for heavy conversations. I will come across harshly here, but you have to suck that up. One point I forgot to mention in my blog was how nuts I was for 3 months, the only reason I was nuts, was because I wasn't talking about my feelings. I had nights where I was off the wall crazy because I was busy trying to hide from my feelings. You have a right to be heard, but they both have a right to be heard to. You 3 have to figure out how to build trust for this to have a chance of working.

And primarily that trust HAS to happen between you and him. If you can't trust in him, you will never trust what they are building. I am glad you recognize that :)


So I told him that I was leaving it in his hands, that he would have to make the decision (no hidden agendas, no testing him) about her visit.

He made his decision, Pengrah is at my house today, and I am looking forward to the evening with both of them. Parameters have been set and we'll see where the evening progresses. But for now, I need to trust that he's going to do what's right for US and I don't ... exactly...


Good for you :)...remember she is there too, you can talk to her about where you hurt and where you are uncomfortable and what you need. Those might be things to talk about tonight. That way there is a reduction of uncomfortable unknowns. It is the unknowns that suck the wind out of things. The more items talked about from all 3 sides the better.

I hope you guys can keep talking tonight and get these things tabled. Its a good step and one that I know is needed for all of you. I have put my feelers out there to Wellington. If he needs any advice or a simply guy moment he is welcome to come to me directly as you are as well.


Today, though, I'm not feeling all twisty inside. I don't need to know what they're talking about or how they're interacting. That's fucking amazing when I think about the last 10 days.

Things are good. I can see the light. I know the problem, we finally got to the core of it all. We can get through this.

Today, I see a happy future. And my feelings match it :)

Good...:)

<<hugs>> @ MBG...:)

[redpepper]

Oh I feel for you in this. I find it harder when I know some of the people involved and care about all of you more as a result.

Take it easy on yourself and everyone else. Rome wasn't built in a day. You all seem to have each others best interest in mind and are wanting to do what is right and respectful by all... it just needs to be sorted out what that looks like I think. There is lots of time and the big ball of yarn will become unraveled.

Just remember that no one wants to purposely hurt you or make you feel bad... they are all trying to get their needs met as much as you are in the best way they know how. It's hard to communicated sometimes with people you don't know very well yet, but those things will sort out as you get to know each other. Again, time. All your communication styles will be revealed. After all, you don't know each other in this way, in this new dynamic.

Big hugs to you... :)

[marksbabygirl]

As for heavy conversations. I will come across harshly here, but you have to suck that up. One point I forgot to mention in my blog was how nuts I was for 3 months, the only reason I was nuts, was because I wasn't talking about my feelings. I had nights where I was off the wall crazy because I was busy trying to hide from my feelings.

Its been 10 days. 10 days since I lost my mind. And my issue wasn't that I didn't want to have the conversations, but that I wasn't going to have them TONIGHT if I still felt that I wasn't clear for ME on what was going on, what I needed and how we could move forward. In the past 10 days I have been talking, talking and more talking. All about my feelings. And until I could get to the core of it all - nothing was being resolved and nothing helped me feel better.

Had we not had that breakthrough, Pengrah wouldn't have come down because it wouldn't have been fair to or respectful of HER to subject her to what was going on with me. It would have been counter-productive to building a solid friendship/relationship between the three of us - it would have degenerated into a nasty ugly night for all of us.

I needed to understand ME before I could offer anything constructive to her or W. I am looking forward to conversations - but in the state I was in before the breakthrough - there was no way they could have happened - it would have been just horrible for us all. I am self-aware enough to KNOW that - and not subject anyone else to that.


You have a right to be heard, but they both have a right to be heard to. You 3 have to figure out how to build trust for this to have a chance of working.

And primarily that trust HAS to happen between you and him. If you can't trust in him, you will never trust what they are building. I am glad you recognize that :)

This is something to work towards. The thing that was making me the craziest was that in the lucid moments, I was genuinely happy for them both, thrilled because I do like her and I like how he is with her. I couldn't figure out what the problem was. Now that I know the problem, W and I will work towards a solution that helps keep us moving forward.

Good for you :)...remember she is there too, you can talk to her about where you hurt and where you are uncomfortable and what you need. Those might be things to talk about tonight. That way there is a reduction of uncomfortable unknowns. It is the unknowns that suck the wind out of things. The more items talked about from all 3 sides the better.

I agree. But Wellington and Pengrah were/are very clear about what they're feeling and where they'd like to go and I wasn't. I am now. Now I can sit and converse and not feel like my world was spinning out of control. I am looking foward to the evening, Pengrah and I have *plans* for girl time and wine.... its going to be a good night.


<<hugs>> @ MBG...:)

I could use one of those in person :p You give great hugs :D

[Magdlyn]

Reading and empathizing and learning from your struggles, MBG.

*more hugs*

[Mohegan]

It seems we a more similar than originaly thought :D. Baking cookies at 2 am while crying and trying to get my damn head straight, became a pretty regular thing around here.


Once again you have helped me find words. I have found a new trust for Karma. But in the whole scheme of things I don't know that I trust him or g/f to do what's best for "us". He thought he was doing what was best when he lied about everything. That broke that trust. They are one relationship and we are on relationship and the two, for right now, don't have a happy medium, so I question the ability to trust that he'll make decisions for the good of he and I.

I hope you both keep talking, keep figuring things out and keep working at it. It's the only way Karma and I are where we are. It's a long hard road when you thought it would all be okay, and it turns out you aren't anywhere near okay with it. I get those questions you ask yourself, b/c I'm at the same place.

I hope you have a smooth and relaxing weekend.

And remember-you're as beautiful as you think you are. Changes in the mind, affect changes in the body. Mind of matter. I'm proof of it.

[marksbabygirl]

We should have talked earlier. There should have been communication, face to face conversation and a lot of miscommunications would have been cleared up.

Pengrah was at my house early in the morning, she and Wellington hung out during the day and for the most part I was ok. Finally got to the end of my work day and panick set in. I was seriously concerned that she and W would be 'ambushing' and 'tag-teaming' me into *accepting* and *getting over it* so that they could move forward.

I couldn't have been more wrong. Didn't stop the panick though.

I get home, they're finishing up dinner, we all had a nice meal - it was lovely. I got hugs from both of them when I came home.

After dinner Pengrah and I went for a walk. Ok, not really a walk - more of a drive to the river, walk part way down discover the river is more swollen than I thought and sit and chatter. For 2 hours. Cleared up a lot of fears and apprehensions on both parts - well at least for me.

End of our "girl time" we're laughing and chattering and torturing Wellington with texts of AHHHHHHH! and "I'm driving her home" followed by "to our house... hehehe" Its fun double-teaming him with mental torture.

Got the boys into bed... we all sat on the couch, Pengrah and me on either side of Wellington.... snuggles all around - the connection was lovely. Finally got to talking between the three of us, which led to some brutal honesty - some tears, some hugs, some understanding and a determination to keep working through all this. We were laughing and chatting still at the end of my night.

I stayed up later than I wanted - about 45 mins after I knew I was ready for bed - I finally broached the "I'm going to bed - I don't expect y'all to go as well - but these are my boundaries and this is my comfort level" It was received well - and they both tucked me in and I had a phenomenal sleep.

Woke up this morning - the connections are still good - the feelings are still good... everyone is, as far as I can tell, happy. :)

Last night was a good good night :D

[Derbylicious]

That's so good to hear. The reality is often far less scary than the fears.

[marksbabygirl]

We have had fantastic moments and horrible moments in the last couple of days.

I hesitate to post the awfulness because what has come out of them has been stronger and more clear.

I just wish trust, and security in my relationship was easy to build back up. I wish I could come as fast as the good feelings.

There was an issue on Friday night - which left me feeling as though the rug had been pulled out from under me. We worked through that.

The analogy of how we worked through it is this:

We are a beautiful puzzle, him and I and our family - with all the pieces fitting perfectly. We have friends who join us occasionally on the edges, but for the most part - we don't need to adjust our puzzle for them to connect. Adding a new significant relationship changes the look of the puzzle. Our children don't have to make any adjustments to their part of the puzzle - they still fit beautifully and are who they are. Right now it is him who is exploring a new relationship - he automatically adjusts to the new person - and his piece of the puzzle is fluid. I am the piece of the puzzle that needs to change, and if he doesn't talk to me or help me with the changes, I start to fall apart.

The puzzle pieces are not hard and unyeilding, kids grow up, people get sick, and new people enter our lives. We are more like placticine - you know, that hard stuff they used to have in school? Where you had to work it to get it soft and pliable? That's how I feel - strong, but if you work with me, I'll become more pliable and adjustable.

So we got that worked out - and then something else happened. And my footing, which was not so solid in the first place, was made more unstable.

We have, after each of these much shorter episodes, come out of them stronger. But right now, I don't feel *quite* safe enough to trust that what I"m standing on will stay steady and strong. It hasn't been for the last couple of days. I need it to be. Because with out that strength and support - I lose my mind.

And this morning... omg he's funny - "how are you doing today hun? Good? Ok, let me see if I can ruin that... " Really?!?!? Start with that line and hope that my mood stays good? *sigh* Not funny haha, although I think that was what he was going for... *sigh*

What I'm left with is, I don't know. I don't know and I need to have a whole day of feeling like I am walking on solid ground. Right now, I don't.

It will come though. I have faith and hope - but the trust isn't quite there.

[marksbabygirl]

We had a phenomenal date night on Thursday. Had some really incredible playtime..... It was awesome. I won't go into the details - those are best left to fetlife. But needless to say - I am still feeling the effects of that play today :D :D

Friday - I got to go out to do a Passion Party - met some people in the poly community - and had a great 3 hour chat with a friend after. Then there was stress - but we worked it out the next day.

Yesterday - I slept most of yesterday - and then there was some unpleasantness - but we ended with a great movie and some really awesome snuggles.

In amongst the bad is good - its not all bad, its not all good - but right now I think the balance is more good than bad - unlike last week where it was more bad than good. :) :D

[marksbabygirl]

No matter how all this turns out - we are both working towards better communication, and in the end our relationship will be stronger, better and more mindful.

For the first time - this is coming from BOTH sides - not just mine... :)

[marksbabygirl]

Learning a new lesson... how to accept "I need to talk but we'll talk about it later"

Best sentence EVER to send my anxieties through the roof.

I need to learn to accept that. I deliberately did NOT push the issue today and in 3 hours will get to have that conversation - in the meantime - there are other things I need to focus on.

Big step for me personally to let it go and simply say "ok, I'll talk to you later"

Now to try not to internally freak out :eek:

[Ilove2men]

Learning a new lesson... how to accept "I need to talk but we'll talk about it later"

Best sentence EVER to send my anxieties through the roof.

I need to learn to accept that. I deliberately did NOT push the issue today and in 3 hours will get to have that conversation - in the meantime - there are other things I need to focus on.

Big step for me personally to let it go and simply say "ok, I'll talk to you later"

Now to try not to internally freak out :eek:

Kuddos to you! This one always sends me in a tailspin.

[SNeacail]

how to accept "I need to talk but we'll talk about it later"

I hate that line, it sends my head into a world of worse case senarios. I'd rather just be approached when the other person is ready to talk than stress about all the possibilities until the talk happens.

My husband did this too me not too long ago. In the meantime, I sent him an e-mail about some stuff I needed to say. After 2 days I finally asked him if he was ready to talk and he said "Oh I thought you weren't interested in hearing what I had to say after your e-mail". WTF?????

We did finally talk and still can't understand why he was afraid to say what he did? I told him, making me stew for 2 days put him in senarios that were 10 times worse that the actual reality.

"Let's (or Can we) talk about stuff tonight when you get home" is much better. Time frame is not open ended and it doesn't sound so ominous. I don't know about everyone else, but once husband and I get on a role, we hit a bunch of topics.

[marksbabygirl]

I have this morning yoga thing I should do every day. It starts with progressive deliberate relaxation. I lay there, deep breathing, listening to the *guy* telling me to relax each part of my body. With each breath I get a little more relaxed, a little less tense. Sometimes, a part of my body that is not doing well tenses up during the exercise and I have to start over again. Back to the beginning of deliberate relaxation.

This journey feels a lot like that. As I move through each step, I'm able to relax more - and even though there might be parts of my body that tense up and I have to start again.... I'm still moving towards relaxation.

Today is a great day. I feel as though I'm almost at that completely relaxed state. Another few deep breaths and I'll be completely ok... :D

[FormerUnicorn]

I hope that great day lasted all day. You totally deserve a bit of tranquility.

[PollyPocket]

Originally Posted by marksbabygirl
Today, though, I'm not feeling all twisty inside. I don't need to know what they're talking about or how they're interacting. That's fucking amazing when I think about the last 10 days.


Not 'quite' the same scenario for us, but soooo similar! I am trying to NOT focus or 'care' or maybe 'observe' with an open mind 'their' conversations and intimacy, but to NOT freak out! It was pointed out to me today that part of this issue most likely stems from my need to 'direct' or 'control' things. Ouch. That one stings.

Maybe just maybe this Poly journey of mine is gonna 'cure' something so ingrained that I thought it was simply instinctual....the need to control. I have to LEARN to let go and let be....and I know that the greatest love will come from that. BUT holy fuck that is a hard lesson to learn!!

[marksbabygirl]

I don't know that tranquility is a word I'd use to describe myself right now - but getting very close to peace and contentment :P

My husband loves my analogies - he gets me much better that way.

I do notice that I am spending less time on the computer lately - more time connected to him - watching tv with him, conversing with him, playing cards with him... its awesome.

Life is good, and I can see it getting better :)

It was pointed out to me today that part of this issue most likely stems from my need to 'direct' or 'control' things.

I am going to look at this one seriously. Thank you for bringing it to my attention... :)

[marksbabygirl]

I read through a couple of threads... was totally unproductive at work yesterday... and had a couple paradigm shifts in my head.

Basically my thinking has changed from restricting what they can do in order to protect US... to doing what I can to support and strengthen US in order to allow them to grow and get closer without it being a threat to US.

Its a huge shift/change for me. I was all about the rules. Now I want to focus on what I'm doing in MY relationship to strengthen and support it rather than putting brakes on what THEY do... although there is some things I'm still not comfortable with - it is less about them and more about us now :)

Yah I don't know if this actually makes sense to anyone but me... however I feel much lighter and more relaxed.

Good day for me yesterday. End of day had me at a friend's house for coffee explaining poly to her - and when I got home Wellington was cranky with me for being out... It came down to communication - he didn't communicate with me that he wanted/needed me home and it created issues... but we worked it out. :D

[redpepper]

Basically my thinking has changed from restricting what they can do in order to protect US... to doing what I can to support and strengthen US in order to allow them to grow and get closer without it being a threat to US.

you're getting it! I totally get this. Its amazing the depth and connection that follows. Just when you think you can't possibly connect any deeper with a partner and then poly comes along. Of course it takes a bit to get to that part, but sticking with it can yield some incredible results.

good for you! :)

[foxflame88]

Basically my thinking has changed from restricting what they can do in order to protect US... to doing what I can to support and strengthen US in order to allow them to grow and get closer without it being a threat to US.

Its a huge shift/change for me. I was all about the rules. Now I want to focus on what I'm doing in MY relationship to strengthen and support it rather than putting brakes on what THEY do... although there is some things I'm still not comfortable with - it is less about them and more about us now :)

You're catching on! Good for you!

[marksbabygirl]

It has totally changed my outlook - makes it easier to get over the speed bumps that crop up :p

It has also let me move forward faster - although there's still things I'm not comfortable with... :p

[Mohegan]

Seems to be the week for breakthroughs!!! Happy for you!!

[Magdlyn]

I dont know how you manage all this, MBG. Full time job, partially disabled husband, 4 kids, and still time/energy for poly partners and kink play? How old are your kids?

[marksbabygirl]

I dont know how you manage all this, MBG. Full time job, partially disabled husband, 4 kids, and still time/energy for poly partners and kink play? How old are your kids?

Kink play keeps me sane.

Kids are 20, 18, 10.5 & 9. Older two are on their own - my 18 year old is on Fetlife....

Hubby is fantastic at running the house - we live with more mess than we'd like - but its a trade-off :)

As I said to a co-worker (we were talking about the # of courses I take for work-related stuff) I just don't sleep ;)

I don't currently have poly partners... or even one - but I look at it as friendships - there's just going to be sex involved ;)

I have friendships that I have been VERY involved in their lives - its just a balancing act.

:)

[marksbabygirl]

I used to be strong.

I used to be confident.

I used to be able to walk through my life, knowing what needed to be done, how to do it and who to delegate if I couldn't.

I built that strength, that confidence on a very shaky foundation. For many years, if I couldn't deal with something - either the other party was unwilling or it simply hurt too bad - I would stuff it. I built a solid-ish block of "not-feeling" on which I drew my strength. Look at me, life throws me curveballs, and while it may not be a home run, I don't strike out.

So I build this foundation on shaky ground, with shoddy materials, and then one day, we do something that blows apart my foundation.

And all of a sudden, I'm not able/allowed to continue to stuff my feelings - let's talk. Lets work through the problems, lets communicate in a way that is healthy and honest and holy fuck I'm so sick of crying.

I don't know what to build my foundation out of. Every time I try to put up walls - there he is, telling me to breathe, to let it out, to just BE... and I don't know how to do this.

I'm great at listening to other peoples problems. I'm not the fair weather friend - I'm the bad weather friend. The one who can always be counted on in a crisis. I do well with a crisis. Then put me in day to day life... ugh.

I don't want to deal with this. I don't want to FEEL like this. I feel broken inside and I don't know how to find my strength again. But I know that if I find it, if I can heal, if I can fix the brokenness - I'll be stronger in the end.

But I'm sick of crying. Who knew I had stuffed everything so effectively for so long... and now its there.

I am grateful that he's there. That he's walking this journey with me. This part is particularly painful - but without it - I would continue to do what I've always done.

There's a saying - "Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results"

I'm done being insane. I just wish I could stop crying.

[marksbabygirl]

Its a leap of faith.

Trust, that is.

Just close my eyes, fall back and have faith that he will be there to catch me. He always has. We've had some issues. We've had some difficulties. But in the end - he's always been there for me.

I just need to close my eyes, take a deep breath, and believe.

[ImaginaryIllusion]

Its a leap of faith.

Trust, that is.

Just close my eyes, fall back and have faith that he will be there to catch me. He always has. We've had some issues. We've had some difficulties. But in the end - he's always been there for me.

I just need to close my eyes, take a deep breath, and believe.

Yes....yes it is. Well put...Thanks...I think I'll send to my gf.

[marksbabygirl]

Don`t be so afraid of losing something, that you jump at every minor difference. Clutching to hard just tends to choke the life out of a relationship.

I want to quote this from another thread. This resonates with me - and is so very important in terms of my paradigm shifts and how I want to look at my poly journey.

Today has been a fairly calm day in my head. What a wonderful feeling :)

[marksbabygirl]

Had an amazing moment of compersion today. Wellington got to surprise Pengrah with a visit - and when he was telling me about her reaction - I got all giddy and excited for them.

I'm glad I was able to help facillitate that :D

[marksbabygirl]

I would really like to be able to express my feelings without fear of anger or fighting.

Right now - I keep trying, but I am afraid that it is doing more harm than good :(

[marksbabygirl]

I don't know how to explain the awesomeness that is in my life right now. The feeling of RIGHT and GOOD and CONTENT overwhelms everything else.

Monday to last night was hell. It was deep, dark, depressive, painful, unhappy, angry and frustrated. We were finally able to talk last night and just be HEARD - both of us.

Came to some agreements. Clarified some things that were important to us. And the weight was lifted. Trust restored.

Lots of hand holding, snuggling, making out and other fun things ensued.

We will continue to check in with each other - make sure we're still on the same page - but for now - everything is awesome :D

[KatTails]

That's awesome!!! I know you've had a rough, emotional week and I'm glad that things are feeling right for you again!

:) Kat :)

[marksbabygirl]

The question remains... post or not to post. And if I do post, how much is reasonable to post?

Some of the story isn't mine - but because it directly affected me - I was hurt and angry.

We watched the movie "Killers" with Katherine Heigl & Ashton Kutcher. At one point he said something like "I work for the blah blah blah with a license to blah"

And in order to tell MY story - I feel like I have to say something like "It started because Wellington was feeling blah and blah about blah"

Because that's where it started. But its not my place to tell their stories.

I can say that we had an amazing night that past Saturday. An awesome intense scene that left me totally focussed on him and the moment. Followed by a fun suspension scene.

Got home late, got up late-ish - then we headed out to the munch I host.

Right after the munch I drove 4 hours to my mom's house, stayed the night, went to an appointment with her then drove the 4 hours home.

An hour or so into the drive sub-drop started hitting me. I called him as soon as I was in cell range - and he was on the phone. I heard him hesitate before telling me he'd get off the phone to talk to me.... and I just convinced myself that I'd be fine for the remainder of his conversation - I have music and can sing myself silly until he's done and able to chat.

45 minutes later...

We're finally able to talk on the phone and he's upset by the phone call. He wants to talk to me when I get home.

Sub-drop pushed aside. I'm concerned, thinking the worst has happened.

We chatter a bit longer and I'm home within an hour and a half - maybe 2 hours.

Get home, get a great hug, and we get the boys situated with a movie and go somewhere mostly private to talk.

He tells me what's going on. I am there for him, I listen, I am comforting, I hug him, I'm glad that the worst doesn't happen.

I figure after the conversation he's excised the stress - and now I"ll be able to get what I need to recover from the sub-drop that has now overwhelmed me.

Get lots of snuggles.

Later that night - he texts her g'night - I say something off the cuff and he's seriously upset again. I was making a joke that should have been "ok" because he told me he was "ok"

We get to bed, I try to talk to him - it results in lots of yelling and crying.

Next morning, we're still not communicating well - more yelling and crying.

Tuesday is a blur. Work was a write off - I should have called in sick. I spent more time on the phone and on text with him trying to sort it all out than I did actually working. Neither of us remember the day or the evening. But it was frustrating and stressful and angry and hurt-y (not in a good way)

Wednesday, more fighting in the morning. At work - had texts & phone calls with him and we're both saying the same things - we want to be heard, we want to work this out, we need the other to listen. All I kept saying to him is I need him to NOT be angry with me because I was trying to express my feelings. I needed to be ablle to tell him what was going on with me and get compassion and caring, instead of anger and frustration. I kept repeating over and over ... I need you to not be angry with me. I hung up on him once... apparently he threw the phone at that point.

We agreed to have a conversation later. Finally came to a place where we were talking. I said to him - there are some points I need to touch on - and we need to talk in person.

So we get to the end of Wednesday. I get home - we sit and have a conversation.

We do the primary/secondary thing. I know that for a lot of people that doesn't work - but for me - I come first. Our family comes first. Everyone else, family friends, lovers, girfriends or boyfriends - come second. We're still working out the practicality of that.

But I was starting to feel like someone he had known a couple months was being given equal footing.

I had asked him (Tuesday I think - maybe Wed) for the remainder of HER vacation with her husband to be just him and I. No texting, no phone calls - she's on vacation with her husband, I wanted some time to focus on us and connect with us. He hesitated. He argued. He got mad. I felt like I was not his primary - it shouldn't be a big deal for him to say "sure honey - 4 days is not long" But it felt like it was.

So it felt like she was being given equal consideration in terms of the things his WIFE needed. Like he had to check with her to find out if it was ok to meet his wife's needs. That was not ok with me.

We had our conversation.

Things got sorted out. It was an amazing conversation - I wont' go into details. But things in my world are right again. My husband and I are on the same page - with the same outlook on poly and how we want poly to look for us.

There are parts to the next few days that aren't my story as well, even though they directly affected me.

He agreed to just him and i during the time I was home. Said yes, it was necessary. We needed to reconnect. There was a good night text - he was going to call her the next morning to let her know the outcome of our conversation - but the text back resulted in a conversation. I was glad that he could have that conversation with her.

I'm mostly ok now - Thursday was a class I was taking (on the computer at home) - Last night was the start of kicking his butt in canasta - and I have the potential of snuggles, board games, card games and movies all weekend because its raining.

However, now I'm in the throes of PMS. I am doing my level best to talk down the insecure, unstable feelings - because I KNOW its not logical. I KNOW that it's all hormonal. And I KNOW - based on our conversation on Wed and another one on Thurs that I can trust him - he cemented that for me. But hormones suck.

I'm so looking forward to this weekend... :D

[Derbylicious]

The ups and downs suck! At some point there will be a new normal in your relationship. Have you tried writing to each other rather than talking about the same thing over and over again? Sometimes a letter really helps because it lets you get your whole train of thought out without being interrupted. Things tend to escalate when you're both needing to be heard at once.

[Breathesgirl]

The ups and downs suck! At some point there will be a new normal in your relationship. Have you tried writing to each other rather than talking about the same thing over and over again? Sometimes a letter really helps because it lets you get your whole train of thought out without being interrupted. Things tend to escalate when you're both needing to be heard at once.

This.

When I feel I'm not being heard I head straight for the computer & pound it all out. The pounding on the keyboard helps with the frustrations & writing always has been cathartic for ME.

Breathes usually takes a couple of days to assimilate what I said without letting me know he's read it (drives me NUTS btw), Possibility will email me to let me know he got it & needs some time to think about it. At any rate I get my say, uninterrupted & without wild tangents creeping up on us (or smart assed/snarky comments from either of us), they learn what's on my mind & I feel better. Win/win all the way for me :D.

[redpepper]

Oh can I relate to you journey... I hope you feel you can Pmsg anytime... I totally get where you are coming from in terms of the putting oneself aside and sucking stuff up temporarily. That and the "everything is okay" "It fucking isn't okay" thing... tettering on the edge of disastrous emotional craziness. sigh... hard work, but it really does become more normal and balanced. A way of dealing occurs at some point I think. It seems to me when everyone is completely exhausted and realizes that no one is going anywhere and we all have to deal...

[Magdlyn]

Gosh I definitely think it woulve been a good idea to just let Pengrah have her vacation w Ari and let her be, and focus on each other while they're gone.

[Breathesgirl]

mbg said : For the first time in our marriage - there are things he won't tell me, and I'm sad about that.

I had a shower with him - and as I got out I turned and said something.. and he stopped the conversation - because of something he was asked not to share with me. It made me sad that he has to watch what he says with me now :(

I understand the need, the right of other people to their privacy. I get it.

We've always had a 'don't ask me to keep a secret from my spouse' relationship. And that's changed. And it makes me sad :(

The balance is hard - how do you balance out one person's right to privacy with an established communication pattern?

This is just too freaking weird! I've got the above in my email but I can't find it on the site! :(

Any way..maybe hubby could explain to SO that the two of you have a no secrets policy so if she doesn't want you to know something then she shouldn't tell him.

[marksbabygirl]

@Breathesgirl - the "blog post" turned into a general discussion of very valid and important points in communication and I asked for it to be moved to General Discussions.

You can find the general discussion here (http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3763)

:)

We're working it out. Its coming to a good conclusion. :)

[marksbabygirl]

Never assume. Always clarify. IF you assume, you make an
ASS out of
U and
ME

I made an assumption today.

W made an assumption today.

Between all the two assumptions - a whole fucking shitstorm of miscommunications happened.

An afternoon was ruined.

And W and I were just sitting - staring at each other - we're perfect for each other - just a pair of dumbasses. If he had TOLD me.... if I had ASKED.... none of the shitstorm would have happened.

I was afraid to come home.

Others were afraid of me coming home.

It didn't make for a good afternoon...

[PollyPocket]

I was afraid to come home.

Others were afraid of me coming home.

It didn't make for a good afternoon...

Ek! I know that feeling. Did you get to talk it out finally? Please say yes.... :)

[Mohegan]

Never assume. Always clarify. IF you assume, you make an
ASS out of
U and
ME

I made an assumption today.

W made an assumption today.

Between all the two assumptions - a whole fucking shitstorm of miscommunications happened.

An afternoon was ruined.

And W and I were just sitting - staring at each other - we're perfect for each other - just a pair of dumbasses. If he had TOLD me.... if I had ASKED.... none of the shitstorm would have happened.

I was afraid to come home.

Others were afraid of me coming home.

It didn't make for a good afternoon...

Karma and I know that scenario all too well. We've gotten better, but sometimes you don't know to ask if they don't say something first.

[foxflame88]

Never assume. Always clarify. IF you assume, you make an
ASS out of
U and
ME

I made an assumption today.

W made an assumption today.

Between all the two assumptions - a whole fucking shitstorm of miscommunications happened.

An afternoon was ruined.

And W and I were just sitting - staring at each other - we're perfect for each other - just a pair of dumbasses. If he had TOLD me.... if I had ASKED.... none of the shitstorm would have happened.



I feel like i just read something you stole out of my head. This is EXACTLY what happened here last week. Things are mending her, i hope they are for you as well.

[SNeacail]

Definitely something is out of alightment. This was my house last week. UUGH!

[marksbabygirl]

Things are much better today... conversation with Wellington - conversation with Pengrah - craft night with the girls (Pengrah & a couple of my friends) - being spoiled with wine & snacks by Wellington.

Snuggles all around ended the night.

Woke up feeling really good - I hope everyone else in my house is feeling as good as I am :) :D

[PollyPocket]

Snuggles all around ended the night.

Woke up feeling really good - I hope everyone else in my house is feeling as good as I am :) :D

Glad to hear MBB....Always good when the skies clear and the sun shines again!!

Wish I could say the same....still feeling sort of *numb* from yesterday's communication nightmare!

P2

[marksbabygirl]

I let go of one final block this morning. Conditionally - because I'm not sure, with how badly my PMS is affecting me, but based on how I'm feeling RIGHT NOW... I think there will be no worries.

I'm good.

I have an upset stomach but after careful consideration - I am pretty sure that's the result of the cinnamon bun and the americano with an extra shot of esspresso.

If I think about them - I don't have a compersion - but I'm not twisty and angry and upset. Huge friggen progress.

I am oh so very tired today. In dire need of an afternoon nap - seriously thinking about hiding in the filing later and napping there :p

But I'm good. I'm in a good place. And its nice :)

[marksbabygirl]

Oh oh oh oh!!! I was reading TruckerPete's blog about rings and realized that something enormously significant happened this past weekend that I wanted to share.

I was talking to my hubby about his wedding ring - I wear his - mine have long since been lost - and how I'd like to see him wearing it again.

His response was that he'd like to tattoo his wedding ring on his finger... :D

I love him. He's awesome.

We're going to save pennies for the next while - but the general plan is around Christmas or my birthday (Jan 16) we'll have matching tattoos :D

Our *rings* will be our wedding date, our names & decorative details to look like a ring.

I can't wait :D

[Livingmybestlife]

Wow! That is awesome. That might solve my ring problem. I have technically 3 of them and I wear....none of them. They itch my finger.

That is such a huge step! I am so happy for you.

L

[MonoVCPHG]

We're going to save pennies for the next while - but the general plan is around Christmas or my birthday (Jan 16) we'll have matching tattoos :D

:D

Very cool Idea...and the most painful tattoo I ever got!

http://www.polyamory.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=121&pictureid=768

[LT4everu2]

We're going to save pennies for the next while - but the general plan is around Christmas or my birthday (Jan 16) we'll have matching tattoos :D



That is so kewl we have talked about that as well. Do it on your birthday and think of me and TL as it is our 20th anniversary :D

[Tonberry]

I've heard about ring tattoos before and I think it's a pretty cool idea... And you don't risk losing it!
Show us pictures once you get them!

Mono, what's yours saying? What does FSFL stand for?

[MonoVCPHG]

I've heard about ring tattoos before and I think it's a pretty cool idea... And you don't risk losing it!
Show us pictures once you get them!

Mono, what's yours saying? What does FSFL stand for?

Forever Sacred Forever Lost....it was a ring from my marraige that I screwed up. The FSFL wasn't always there :o

[Tonberry]

Aww I'm sorry Mono. Nice story though. I mean, not nice as in "I'm glad all that happened to you" (although I guess that's how you ended up with redpepper so it's not all bad) but I like hearing the stories behind tattoos.

[marksbabygirl]

The little blurps of emotion are just that now... little blurps.

Instead of anger and hurt feelings taking over a night, trashing a day or an entire week...

My level of "OK-ness" has gotten to a point where something happens, I get upset, I have a cry, I talk it out and its done - usually within about 1/2 hour.

Today is a very good day :)

I adore my husband.

[Derbylicious]

Glad to hear it MBG...I hope things keep getting better for you!

[marksbabygirl]

I'm drowning. It is almost too much to hold on.

Changing communication styles after 12 years together isn't impossible, but it has been extremely difficult.

I'm drowning. He is my lifeline.

I need to find a way out of the water before its too late... :(

[Livingmybestlife]

Hugs MBG, remember you just need to breath each minute. Reach out to someone else for comfort. I can't always get what I need from BF and hubs.

I am going through lots of change with hubs right now as well. It is hard, and I know we will come out the other side.

[Derbylicious]

I know how it feels to feel like your drowning and that the person who you usually reach for is the cause of that feeling. At the moment it's just one day at a time. You are strong and you will get through this!

[marksbabygirl]

Sometimes I feel that if I posted as much as was going on I'd spend more time on the computer than in real life.

I did something odd last night - I plugged in my cell phone, and turned off the computer.

Layed on the couch, feet up on his lap and read a book while he chatted with Pengrah on the phone (for a bit) and we watched TV.

It has been an extremely up and down week or so. I posted a bit of it in another thread...

Monday last week - was good and bad. There were some frustrating issues between Wellington and I - and his "getting lost" in the moment. Also, on paydates - there's lots to do - and when paydates co-incide with a visit between him and Pengrah - well - the errands HAVE to be run - but its not really a fun visit for them.

Monday got sorted - Tuesday night there were some issues, and then we hit Wednesday. Wednesday was hellish for everyone, all round. Finally got that sorted - and then Thursday. Thursday was a mostly good day until Thursday evening. Got that sorted.

Then Friday. Friday morning had some issues - Friday was a phenomenal day.

Saturday - not so much. Saturday I was ready to walk out of my marriage because I couldn't handle what was happening. Stupid thing is it had/has nothing to do with poly. The issues were between Wellington and I - and the fights that happened were unrelated to Pengrah.

But between the Wednesday fight - and then all the little fights, Saturday was a breaking point.

I can't be the villain anymore. I can't be in the wrong anymore. It HAS to be ok for me to not be ok without it turning into a huge fucking mess. And it hasn't been. I have felt like if I was not ok with something - no matter HOW I presented it - I was going to be the villain. I was going to be the bad guy. And I can't always be that. I am working SO hard on my comfort zones - I am working with everything I have to push myself past the comfortable routines and boundaries - that when I've pushed myself too far and need to step back - it seems to be unacceptable.

I think he gets it now - I think he understands what I'm doing and why and how hard I'm trying. The learning curve has been incredibly steep and painful.

A few lessons learned:
1. He is not a good translator. If information needs to flow between Pengrah & me - we need to do it without the translations. What takes me 3 hours to explain to him so that he understands, she understands with one sentence.

2. He will, in an effort to not hurt either of us - hurt both of us. Plans were for her to come down to our house to visit today - they need connect time - and need alone time. We have sick kids. I told him - you need to CALL her and let her know - so that she's not surprised. She needs to be able to make an informed decision. He was afraid of hurting/disappointing her - but in the end - it worked out. Had he not told her in an effort not to hurt/disappoint her - *I* think she would have been more hurt - I would have been.

3. Its ok for me to not be ok - but I need to express that in a more constructive way. I can and have been fairly caustic and I'm working on that.

4. When I am ok with our relationship - I am ok with their relationship. It all stems from security. The less secure I feel with him - the more uncomfortable I am with them.

5. He has noticed a direct corolation between my "Ok-ness" and conversations with Pengrah. I come home from a conversation with her - and I'm good. I'm ok. I'm happy. I'm relaxed.

We're good, today. I'm good. I'm not leaving him - I'm not ending my marriage - but I am wary because of things that were said and how very badly I was hurt over the weekend. I am still working on being ok. And after I have that - then I'll look for compersion. :D

[foxflame88]

Your past few posts remind me soooo much how I've been feeling the past few weeks in my own situation. If you would like to bend a third party ear that understands, feel free to message me. ((hugs))

[PollyPocket]

3. Its ok for me to not be ok - but I need to express that in a more constructive way. I can and have been fairly caustic and I'm working on that.

4. When I am ok with our relationship - I am ok with their relationship. It all stems from security. The less secure I feel with him - the more uncomfortable I am with them.

5. He has noticed a direct corolation between my "Ok-ness" and conversations with Pengrah. I come home from a conversation with her - and I'm good. I'm ok. I'm happy. I'm relaxed.

We're good, today. I'm good. I'm not leaving him - I'm not ending my marriage - but I am wary because of things that were said and how very badly I was hurt over the weekend. I am still working on being ok. And after I have that - then I'll look for compersion. :D

MBG....this sounds allllll tooooo familiar! The thing is for me that I tried! I tried really hard. I sucked it up, lost weight, vomitted in the morning, went to counseling sessions, spent $$$$....and I think that I am finally at the point, where I have to say, "I just cannot do it".

It pains me so much to accept this, but if I don't accept it, the consequences will be too far reaching to pull back in.

I hope that you are able to find some peace.

Take care,
P2

[Mohegan]

In different context, it sounds like what my last few months have been.

things here are on an upswing, I hope they are for you as well.

[redpepper]

Hey M, if ever you need to talk. For what its worth, I'm here to bend an ear. :)

[marksbabygirl]

I hate the word *should*

I *should* be at this place.
I *should* be at that place.
I *should* be at this or that level of ok-ness.

Until he told me what he meant by it - I just kept thinking that I'm NOT at this place or that place or this or that level of ok-ness and if I'm NOT - then I must not be good enough.

If I'm not, I must be the one in the wrong.

I must be the bad guy.

But then I told him what I felt when I heard it, he told me what he meant when he said it - and he's agreed to stop using it - because no matter what else he might say - I will forever hear "if you're NOT there when I think you SHOULD be, then you're not good enough"

And if I'm not good enough - then someone else must be better for him.

And if someone else is better for him.... well, you can see the line of thought.

Much simpler to just stop using the word "should" in reference to my feelings. I *should* myself enough for the both of us.

On another learning curve - I had 2 very awesome ladies tell me something similar. If I need something from him, I need to TELL him that. Not assume that he'll get it right the first time.

"Honey - I need to vent, I need to talk UNinterrupted and I need you to listen. After I'm done - I need you to hug me and hold me and reassure me that we'll be ok"

And if necessary - I'll do that at the start of every conversation - because when I said that to him - he lit up - and everything that followed was awesome. He knew exactly what I needed and I got exactly what I needed so we stayed on the same level - no miscommunications.

I'm learning.

[marksbabygirl]

I am discovering that a lot of my anxiety and panicks have less to do with poly and more to do with my brain chemistry.

Poly gives me a focus, but I think that if I didn't have that to focus on - I'd *find* something else to panick about.

There's still issues to resolve, but the panick and twisty-ness I think will lessen as I do the things I'm supposed to to manage my anxiety.

[marksbabygirl]

If you break a bone, when it heals, the part that had been broken is stronger.

I am clinging to that as hope. There are several things that have broken in my marriage in recent weeks.

Recently found out that not only did they do something I specifically asked them not to (and he told me they wouldn't) but it was kept from me, by omission until there was an inadvertent slip of the tongue.

I need successes. I feel like I walk forward, push past my comfort zone and am slapped in the face. Sometimes its a small slap, sometimes its a cast iron frying pan to the side of the head. I need to be able to walk out of my comfort zone and nothing happens. Its good. What was said is true, and what was promised remains. I need a series of those successes. Right now I'm afraid of walking forward, because the fallout, the slaps have been so hard to handle. I don't want to hurt this much anymore. I want it to be good, because when its good, its REALLY good.

But the bad is horrific.

So I'm holding on to the hope that when we heal (not if, because I have to believe that we will heal) we will be stronger.

[Derbylicious]

MBG this is all a big learning process with no rule book on how things are supposed to go. It does get better and things do get easier. Things are always going to come up but you find a way to move through it quicker and to identify exactly why you feel the way you do.

And unfortunately your husband and metamour are human and they make mistakes. Sometimes these mistakes are really really painful. From what I know of both of them, they aren't doing things maliciously to hurt you. If you can't trust in anything else right now try to trust in your husband's intentions.

I'm sorry this is so crappy for you. You'll be here in not too long, fancy going out on the town? I'll have to ask my hubby if he minds keeping the kids for the evening but I think we should go out and have some fun. You sound like you're in much need of fun!

[redpepper]

MBG this is all a big learning process with no rule book on how things are supposed to go. It does get better and things do get easier. Things are always going to come up but you find a way to move through it quicker and to identify exactly why you feel the way you do.

And unfortunately your husband and metamour are human and they make mistakes. Sometimes these mistakes are really really painful. From what I know of both of them, they aren't doing things maliciously to hurt you. If you can't trust in anything else right now try to trust in your husband's intentions.

I'm sorry this is so crappy for you. You'll be here in not too long, fancy going out on the town? I'll have to ask my hubby if he minds keeping the kids for the evening but I think we should go out and have some fun. You sound like you're in much need of fun!

Oh oh oh when?! I must write it on the calender so I can make sure I'm free! See we going out ladies?! :D I'm surrounded by boys and need girl time!

[marksbabygirl]

MBG this is all a big learning process with no rule book on how things are supposed to go. It does get better and things do get easier. Things are always going to come up but you find a way to move through it quicker and to identify exactly why you feel the way you do.

It is getting quicker, easier, but at the same time more painful. We had an amazingly painful, horrible, understanding, healing conversation last night in the space of about 30 minutes while my friends were waiting for me downstairs (it was craft night - they were busy chatting and crafting)

And unfortunately your husband and metamour are human and they make mistakes. Sometimes these mistakes are really really painful. From what I know of both of them, they aren't doing things maliciously to hurt you. If you can't trust in anything else right now try to trust in your husband's intentions. This is what is keeps me going. I know that they don't have malicious intentions, I know that they care for me and I know that the learning curve is so very steep for all of us, especially with all of us being new. I am grateful that he CAN get to that point of understanding. I wish it didn't have to be so painful to get there.

I'm sorry this is so crappy for you. You'll be here in not too long, fancy going out on the town? I'll have to ask my hubby if he minds keeping the kids for the evening but I think we should go out and have some fun. You sound like you're in much need of fun!

HELL YA~!!

I need to get out, let loose and not have to worry about things. But yes, getting out on the town and having fun sounds like a great time :D

[marksbabygirl]

Oh oh oh when?! I must write it on the calender so I can make sure I'm free!

I will be in Victoria for the school field trip on October 28 & 29. I'm planning on ditching the rest of the class, taking my boy(s) and hanging out the night of the 29th and going home on the 30th :)

[Derbylicious]

want to babysit for us the evening of the 28th? I have a ball to go to that night and no sitter yet :)

Oh and I will make it up to you with fun times on the 29th :D

[marksbabygirl]

I would, I so would... unfortunately I will be bunking down in South Park Elementary gym with 60 kids.. :(

[Derbylicious]

I would, I so would... unfortunately I will be bunking down in South Park Elementary gym with 60 kids.. :(

Ummm fun?

[redpepper]

want to babysit for us the evening of the 28th? I have a ball to go to that night and no sitter yet :)

Oh and I will make it up to you with fun times on the 29th :D

One of the women from our group just posted a Halloween party on the 30th. Looks like we are going. But I put you both down for the 29th. I called in a "girls night" *whince* only because Mono said its PG... poly girls :mad: he's driving me crazy.

[marksbabygirl]

Ummm fun?

Hmmm I wish. First thing I will need wherever I land on Friday afternoon is a shower :eek:

[marksbabygirl]

I wonder how my life got so busy.

For the last few weeks - my schedule's been full.

Tuesdays have had *something* (ladies night, karaoke)
Wednesdays is craft night with my friends (at my house)
Thursdays is my course in the early evening.

Weekends have been busy - this weekend, aside from being Thanksgiving, I'm working on Saturday - doing a car seat clinic.

Next Saturday, doing another car seat clinic.

I know something's going on on the 23rd - but I can't remember what.

The following weekend I'll be in Victoria (after the kid's field trip) Crap - gotta find out if I'll be missing anything important for my course on the Thursday night :O

But when did my life get so busy?

[Derbylicious]

Hmmm I wish. First thing I will need wherever I land on Friday afternoon is a shower :eek:

Well if you do decide to stay with us we have one of those!

[marksbabygirl]

I am loving my life right now.

I made a decision. I put it into action. And I am relaxed, content and happy :)

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

[Ariakas]

I am loving my life right now.

I made a decision. I put it into action. And I am relaxed, content and happy :)

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

Have I ever told you how awesomely vague your posts are :p...haha

[marksbabygirl]

Have I ever told you how awesomely vague your posts are :p...haha

Awesomely vague. I love it.

:p

[Derbylicious]

What Ari said...spill the plan lady :)

[marksbabygirl]

What Ari said...spill the plan lady :)

There's no real "plan"

I've been doing a lot of reading lately. Books, forums, and absorbing.

Love is a choice.

Happiness is a choice.

I have learned more about who I am - I don't know exactly where I fit on the non-monogamy spectrum - but I did figure out where my issues come from.

Regardless of where I personally end up - I know that I love my husband and that he loves me and his feelings for anyone else don't supercede that - they add to it.

And sometimes regardless of my feelings and twisty-ness - I need to make the choice to be loving, to be happy. I made that choice this weekend. Its been amazing.

We managed to have a conversation this morning - was a potential minefield.

At the end of the conversation I didn't have what *I* needed - and both of us were somewhat uncomfortable - but we had the conversation without yelling, screaming, crying or serious stress. It was amazing. It was awesome.

I know that time and successes will give me what I need. And I'm patient enough to wait for it :)

[marksbabygirl]

I'm sick. I'm in that inbetween place where I could tough it out, go to work and hope to hell I don't get worse or stay home and take care of myself.

P & W had plans for a visit today at our house.

The basics of it all were if I was at work, she was coming over, but if I was at home, she wasn't. So I felt conflicted about taking the time I needed to get well because it would mess up their plans for the day.

I know, logically, that the conflict is all internal. But I, little miss subbie people pleaser, do not want to disappoint or upset others.

He assured me that I need to just do what I need to do and feel comfortable staying home if I need to. Its my home. I don't take days off *just because* I go to work sick, tired, and when I shouldn't. So for me to take a day off - I really am sick.

I still feel bad though. Just not bad enough to force myself to go to work :cool:

[marksbabygirl]

I am... sad.

I don't know why...

I'm snuggled up on my couch with my hubby and my youngest boy watching a movie and eating popcorn.

And I"m sad. I have been feeling a pervasive sadness for several days.

I am making some changes, clearing up some clutter, and hoping that I can clear the mental clutter as well.

*sigh*

[Derbylicious]

Maybe it has something to do with being sick. Wait till the sick passes and see if you're less sad when you feel well. <big hugs>

[marksbabygirl]

Thanks Derby.

I will give it some time - could be just being sick. Plus a few things that happened over the last few days.

I cleared 2 1/2 garbage bags of clothes out of my closet and dresser today. All clothes I didn't like, didn't fit or didn't want.

10 minutes later - someone picked them up - no chance of them making their way back into my closet :P

Put away all my clothes - in one dresser and the closet. :p Can totally declutter an entire dresser tomorrow :D

[marksbabygirl]

Physically, the simplest little things take time to heal. A torn cuticle, a bruise, a cut finger, a broken leg. A friend of mine, a year ago, dropped a shelf on her toe, breaking the end of her big toe, and destroying the nail. That is still not healed.

If you are bruised, and if, over several weeks, you are hit over and over in that same spot, the bruise will get bigger, more painful and eventually, your life is overwhelmed with the pain of that bruise. The healing never gets a chance to happen.

Eventually, your life becomes all about the massive hematoma.

Emotionally, for me, it works the same. Hurt me, and it takes time to heal. Hurt me over and over and over, and the healing never gets a chance to happen. Eventually, my life becomes all about the hurt.

There's good times in there, happy times - but if they're followed by more pain, it all comes back in force, all the cumulative little things and massively painful things. Like poking a bruise you had sort of forgotten about - until its hit again and the pain blossoms and you remember how much it hurts.

I think about Kattails & 2Rings & MorningGlory - and I wonder if Kattails ever got the time to heal from the initial pain. I understand, if she didn't - why she's at the place she's at - everything is all built up and life is about pain - regardless of the good times that may happen in between bouts of pain.

I wonder why some people think emotions heal faster than a bruise. (Don't want to generalize, but it seems to be a male trait more than a female one) Why a single conversation is expected to erase the enormous amount of pain one is feeling. A hug starts the healing process.... it doesn't finish it.

I changed my communication style today. I decided to be proactive, and think about what I needed to say to him and how I was going to say it. I preambled, I laid it out, I did my best to curb my tendency to repeat myself, and I told him not only did I not want an answer, what I needed was for him to take the information I had given him, and think about it. I want/need to revisit the conversation when he's had time to think about it. We both need for it to be proactive - not reactive - and find a solution that works.

I want this, I want it to work, I want it to be as good as I've seen it can be - the glimpses of possibilities have been amazing - but right now, I need for the bruises to heal. I just don't know how to do that.

[marksbabygirl]

I had a major panick attack this morning. Scared the hell out of me, surprised me with its intensity and how unexpected it was.

Thank goodness for anti-anxiety meds. The physical symptoms have subsided - but the underlying panick is still there. I haven't had a panick attack that severe in months....

Need to get through today and get home to my love for snuggles and aftercare :)

[Livingmybestlife]

Panic attacks suck! I hate them.

[marksbabygirl]

For the first time in a long time, I feel hope. I feel safe in talking to him again.

The bruise has started to truly heal.

We've contacted a poly-friendly psychologist, and between that, the breakthrough we had last night and the conversation we had this morning, I think that WE are finally in the healing process.

[KatTails]

That's awesome!!! How did you break the man code? When I talk - all 2rings hears is mwah, mwah, mwah, hurt, mwah, mwah, angry, mwah, mwah! Frustrating!

Glad things are looking up for you guys!
:)

[SNeacail]

How did you break the man code? When I talk - all 2rings hears is mwah, mwah, mwah, hurt, mwah, mwah, angry, mwah, mwah! Frustrating!

This is funny. My husband does this too, he just completely zones out and only hears about 2 words. I think alot of times we spout out "Too Much Information". It doesn't help that I tend to go on and on and on and talk in circles sometimes :rolleyes:. For me it works better to just tell him "You really hurt me today" and then it's up to him to ask me for the details and when he's asking, he listens to the answers better. I still have to remember to keep my statements short and on point.

@MBG - Totally awsome!!! :D

[Ariakas]

Have you ever tried to be REALLY concise. I mean, skip all the stuff around what you want to say, just say "I don't like this, thanks. Enjoy your beer"

Seriously, might work. I have learned with Pengrah to just stop her when she starts rambling and ask..."sweety, what is the actual point to this conversation"...then I see what she wants and we can discuss.

Instead of getting frustrated over and over again about "only hearing two words"...maybe get your point in, in those 2 words and see what happens. Its hard, trust me I have worked with Pengrah on this, it is completely foreign to those who don't do it. They dance around and weave around topics hoping to not scare or hurt their partner, when all you are doing is disconnecting the story from the point you are trying to make. You will likely find, once the point is made and clear, you can THEN have that discussion.

at least that's how it works for me. This isn't a gender thing, its a communication style difference (unfortunately the dance around the topic style seems to be really prevalent arg). SJ, for example, is very good at bringing the topic to the front, beating the crap out of it and then there is an open discussion.

[marksbabygirl]

Have you ever tried to be REALLY concise. I mean, skip all the stuff around what you want to say, just say "I don't like this, thanks. Enjoy your beer"

Seriously, might work. I have learned with Pengrah to just stop her when she starts rambling and ask..."sweety, what is the actual point to this conversation"...then I see what she wants and we can discuss.

Instead of getting frustrated over and over again about "only hearing two words"...maybe get your point in, in those 2 words and see what happens. Its hard, trust me I have worked with Pengrah on this, it is completely foreign to those who don't do it. They dance around and weave around topics hoping to not scare or hurt their partner, when all you are doing is disconnecting the story from the point you are trying to make. You will likely find, once the point is made and clear, you can THEN have that discussion.

at least that's how it works for me. This isn't a gender thing, its a communication style difference (unfortunately the dance around the topic style seems to be really prevalent arg). SJ, for example, is very good at bringing the topic to the front, beating the crap out of it and then there is an open discussion.

You're right. Its not a gender thing, its a communication thing.

The problem is that that approach only works if two conditions are present:

1. The person trying to get their point across has a clear understanding of the point. Sometimes - its a matter of having to talk it out to understand it clearly.

2. The person who's "listening" actually hears what's being said - not what he or she WANTS to hear based on their perception of the situation. Last night Wellington and I had a major breakthrough. In MY perception - I have been saying the same things over and over and over but he just didn't *GET* it. Apparently last night I was crystal clear. I thought I was saying the same things in the same way... but he got it last night.

And all of a sudden, I didn't need to repeat myself.

And for the first time in a very long time, it felt like a weight had been lifted, it felt like the world was clear and I had no tears left. Nothing was resolved. The problems still exist. But now we're working from a common ground - I don't feel like I'm alone in this. I feel good.

[Ariakas]

And for the first time in a very long time, it felt like a weight had been lifted, it felt like the world was clear and I had no tears left. Nothing was resolved. The problems still exist. But now we're working from a common ground - I don't feel like I'm alone in this. I feel good.

Sorry, I meant to say congrats, its a great feeling when that happens. Regardless of the other stuff going on :)

((hugs)) and a big congrats to you for getting to that point.

[Tonberry]

Great point about communication, I have the same kind of problem with Ragabash, I'm more about direct speech, he's more about indirect speech, and when he beats around the bush I end up just tuning him out... Without meaning to, really, I just can't focus because it seems to be going all over the place and nowhere at the same time!

I want to add my congrats to the lot!

[SNeacail]

1. The person trying to get their point across has a clear understanding of the point. Sometimes - its a matter of having to talk it out to understand it clearly.

2. The person who's "listening" actually hears what's being said - not what he or she WANTS to hear based on their perception of the situation. Last night Wellington and I had a major breakthrough. In MY perception - I have been saying the same things over and over and over but he just didn't *GET* it. Apparently last night I was crystal clear. I thought I was saying the same things in the same way... but he got it last night.

My husband decides I'm just processing so he decides to just check out. If I ask him to repeat back what I said (like our councelor suggested), he says "Oh, I'm sorry, I thought you were just processing. What did you say?" UUGH!

We had one of those "GET IT" moments about a month ago on something that has been going back and forth for 18 years. I totally understand that feeling of absolute relief.

[Morningglory629]

I am with Ari on this one. In my experience with them, most men need direct, no-frills, succinct dialogue. Anything else and there is distraction, they go off task- simply put they are attention deficit. Of course I kind of think in a more masculine way- I do not like wordy, flowery or just too much damn detail in an exchange- ESPECIALLY if someone needs something from me. Just tell me outright! Glad things are working out for you MBG with W. Best of luck.:)

[marksbabygirl]

I love my husband.

Yesterday, we had an "issue"

We mostly resolved it - but then I went and got drunk. (not on purpose - that wine just has a major kick)

Apparently I felt the need to "talk" while inebriated. Which wasn't a good or nice thing. And in between breaths - fell asleep.

I was not nice to my husband last night -and don't remember most of it. I wish with all my heart I could take that back - he doesn't deserve how I treated him last night, and now there are stresses between us today.

I wish I could take last night back. I wish I could get us back to the place we were when we walked into the house together. The place where we were on Tuesday night.

I am deeply sorry for how I treated him and how I messed things up :(

[Myzka]

I love my husband.

Yesterday, we had an "issue"

We mostly resolved it - but then I went and got drunk. (not on purpose - that wine just has a major kick)

Apparently I felt the need to "talk" while inebriated. Which wasn't a good or nice thing. And in between breaths - fell asleep.

I was not nice to my husband last night -and don't remember most of it. I wish with all my heart I could take that back - he doesn't deserve how I treated him last night, and now there are stresses between us today.

I wish I could take last night back. I wish I could get us back to the place we were when we walked into the house together. The place where we were on Tuesday night.

I am deeply sorry for how I treated him and how I messed things up :(

I'm sorry to hear that, MBG!!! *hugs*

Nothing can be resolved when drunk, even though it feels that way...and I've had a couple of conversations like that with my partner, where he wanted to express what he was feeling, but when drunk, it's pretty much impossible for some to disengage and see other perspectives, you are pretty much in the moment of the problem that is bothering you right this second.

So we have an agreement now, when the moment one of us knows what's coming, the listening part just says calmly that they would like to hear what the other side wants to say, but not now, wait till morning and then just leave the room and go to bed (or if already in bed, just turn around and go to sleep or pretend to be sleeping)...eventually things get calm, and it's hard to argue when the other side isn't arguing back...In the morning we talk and it's much much better :)

hugs,
-myzka

[marksbabygirl]

Must remember that for poly to work for me - Pengrah and I need regular conversations.

I am in a good place today. Things with hubby are easy, loving and kind again. No tears, no threatened tears, no stress. I told him that I wanted our weekend to be relaxed, and that if there were any heavy conversations to be had, could we please schedule them for Sunday? :p

I have realized over the past week and more so in the last couple of days that I am falling in love with his brother. I am sad that he had to go, and will miss him terribly. Last night I wanted nothing more than to hold his hand and snuggle up to him - and when he went to bed, I wanted to join him.

He's 8 hours away. Visits are not quick and easy - and I don't know how comfortable he is with poly - but I'm happy for any time I get with him.

Its been a good visit :)

[FormerUnicorn]

Oh Jane, this is all very good to hear. *hugs*

[marksbabygirl]

Feeling sad today.

Felt sad yesterday.

Right now - feeling that *lump* in my throat that tells me that I need to cry - but I'm at work and the filing's all done (can't hide in the back) and so I am in the front dealing with people.

I have to get back to the gym - starting to feel my depression creep back...

I am ok - just very sad.

[marksbabygirl]

Sometimes knowing the problem is more important than fixing the symptoms.

[marksbabygirl]

Had a conversation with Wellington last night - teary and sad again - depression has hit me hard. Must get to the gym and eat healthy - hopefully I won't have to go back on meds.

I want so badly for things to just be "ok" and for things to be easy and smooth. I want to not hurt or get twisty when W. & Pengrah are together. I want to be ok.

For the first time, I don't feel pressured to move faster, go further, push past the boundaries. For the first time, I truly feel like its ok to not be ok. For me to say - I can't handle this - and they will be patient and he will help me work through it.

I have so many painful things running around in my head - and they reverberate, causing more pain and less trust. These things that have been said to me - and it will only stop (as far as I can see) when I've been able to override those experiences with good, successful ones.

I feel, despite my not being completely ok and happy - that finally things are on a good track. I feel safe talking to W. And that is so awesome. The bruise may truly be healing.

[marksbabygirl]

I hate when what I want/need is diametrically opposed to what other people want/need.

I hate having to always be the one to give in, make sacrafices, compromise.

It sucks.

This time its not *poly* related per se - its fun times related.

My wants/needs vs my family's wants/needs.

Hubby says to do what I need/want - we'll figure out everything else later.

My sense of obligation says do what's best for my family.

UGH.

[SNeacail]

Hubby says to do what I need/want - we'll figure out everything else later.

My sense of obligation says do what's best for my family.

UGH.

Sounds like your hubby is willing to shoulder the burden of the family on this. Let him be your hero, let him be the faimly hero. Ok, I know that actual situation makes a difference, but how often have you sacrificed your needs for the needs of the family out of obligation, just because you didn't ask for an alternative.

[marksbabygirl]

Decision was made for me. And not a happy, I get to have fun this weekend decision. A "sucks to be you" decision. :(

UGH.

[redpepper]

Decision was made for me. And not a happy, I get to have fun this weekend decision. A "sucks to be you" decision. :(

UGH.

Is this a "not going to visit RP and Derby" decision?

[Ariakas]

Decision was made for me. And not a happy, I get to have fun this weekend decision. A "sucks to be you" decision. :(

UGH.

I have mentioned your ability to be awesomely vague before, right? :p

[marksbabygirl]

Is this a "not going to visit RP and Derby" decision?

I sent Derby an email which she has my permission to share with you... but short answer is yes. I don't get to stay the extra night.

:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

[marksbabygirl]

I have mentioned your ability to be awesomely vague before, right? :p

You're on my facebook - its all there LOL - just not the reasons :p

[Ariakas]

You're on my facebook - its all there LOL - just not the reasons :p

jesus I gotta hit 3 sites to track your life down. fet, face and poly :p

[marksbabygirl]

jesus I gotta hit 3 sites to track your life down. fet, face and poly :p

Stalker.

You could always email/text me directly and ask me... :eek::D

[Ariakas]

Stalker.

You could always email/text me directly and ask me... :eek::D

ya I could,but I like feeling cool :p...haha

[Derbylicious]

I sent Derby an email which she has my permission to share with you... but short answer is yes. I don't get to stay the extra night.

:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

I read this and thought that you wanted me to post the email...I think maybe I need another cup of coffee! (aren't you glad I read your post again before sharing the email with EVERYONE) :p

[marksbabygirl]

I read this and thought that you wanted me to post the email...I think maybe I need another cup of coffee! (aren't you glad I read your post again before sharing the email with EVERYONE) :p

Eep! Yep - glad you re-read it :p I'll respond to your facebook in a bit.

[marksbabygirl]

Don't know that I'll be around the forums.

I'm not wired poly. I tried. I kept trying - because he loves her and I didn't want to be the reason he ended it.

It was killing me - there are certain rooms in my house I just don't go into now - and I kept it from him - how much I was truely hurting.

I felt dead inside.

I love him enough not to ask him to end things because I don't want him to hurt. He hurts watching me hurt. And now I get to hurt because he's hurting. And its just a fucking shitstorm of pain all around. And I am hurting because I have caused hurt. I have caused pain.

I see how it can work - and how good it can be - but I am wired for emotional monogamy. I thought I could re-wire my brain... I just can't.

Thank you to all who I have connected with - if you have me on fb or email and wish to keep in touch - please do. Friends are so very important.