very confused

[racer812]

okay, here it goes. this will be a long explanation so that hopefully i can get some good advice. i have been with my wife for almost 20 years. i was her first sexual partner and she is the love of my life. we have always had a some what open relationship. we have played with other couples and had a few threesomes. all of this was in the name of experimentation and curiousity. i think we have an excellent relationship, we have always been able to talk about all of our feelings. about 2 months ago my wife gets on facebook and finds her ex boyfriend, he is her first love, she is my first and only love. being a man the whole idea of getting in touch with the ex didnt sit well with me. we worked out my feelings and she made a weekend getaway with him. now i have shared my wife "pyshically" when we partied with others but this is the first time that i have had to share her emotionally. she has told me that she still has feelings for him and still has love for him. the wife has reassured me on several occasions that im her life, her love, but she cannot deny the feelings she has for him. i have been dealing with emotions of jealousy and insecurity and now i think that i am depressed. i have never allowed my self to open my heart to the possibility of loving another. not sure i can. my wife has always been my life. now she is planning more getaways and im not sure i can handle it. the whole emotional rollercoaster is slowly killing me inside. she has no plans to stop contact with him. how do the men handle the roller coaster? sorry i just kinda rambled, but i dont really have anybody to ask for advice.

[MonoVCPHG]

I've got nothing to offer for advice but take care and look after your own health. I hope things work out for the best of all of you.

Mono

[idealist]

I'm not in your situation, but just wanted to welcome you and encourage you to continue sharing and reading this forum. There are a lot of people here with good advice and willing to share their own thoughts and feelings. For me, the main philosphy which is underlying the polyamorous lifestyle is the realization that a person can be in love with more than one person and the love they have for a second person does not diminish the love they have for the first person....in fact, it seems to enhance the love for the first person. A very interesting thing happens in polyamorous relationships and when you experience it, you will know it. It's the opposite of jealousy.....it's called compersion.....and it's when you look at your lover and feel happiness because they are happy. The one thing I might suggest is that you request to have a friendship with the guy. That way, you can keep yourself in reality rather then creating all sorts of fantasies about him in your mind. He's only just another human being after all.......

[TL4everu2]

Dazed,
The best advice I can give you is this: communicate with your wife. Tell her how depressed you are over it. TELL her how jealous you are. TELL her that you are having a hard time dealing and coping with it.

ASK her if she can slow it down a bit with her ex, for you.

The main thing is to COMMUNICATE. No matter how rediculous your feelings may seem, tell her about them.

[girlcaleb]

As I am not in your situation, I can not tell you how to fix this. I hope other members will read this and offer thier two cents. I can say that the best thing you can do now is take care of yourself. I have been deeply depressed before. It can really take a toll on your body and spirit. Try to focus on yourself when you start getting down. I am dealing with a new love intrest that my guy has. I find that keeping busy when I get jealous or worried helps. I go for walks with my dog, do house work. Anything to keep my focus on something that can make me better... or help keep the house in order.

It seems hard, you know she doesn't want to stop seeing this guy. What does she expect from you? Have you asked her yet? Is she just asuming that you are going to be okay with it? Whatever you decide to do, just make sure you keep talking about it. I told my guy recently that I was going to be a little more needy in some respects because he does have a new "friend"... he understands this. I am his primary partner and I should not be afraid to ask for a little help when it comes to dealing with the emotional stuff. Maybe you and the wife can find something to work on together to help you both open up and figure out where this is going.

If I were in your shoes I would want to know her long term plans. I hate surprises. Do you think she would be okay to sit down and go over her goals? As soon as I found out my guy was into this one particular girl, I sat down with him (many times) and asked where exactly he wanted to take this. It sounds silly but I ask him almost daily if he still likes me and wants me as a friend/girlfriend/life partner. I know the answer is yes, but I always want to hear him say it. It makes me happy. I just want to know if he still enjoys me enough to want me to stay around. I'm going nowhere with this... I guess what I'm trying to say is, does she have a way to remind you that you are her #1 and she's not going anywhere? Something to make you feel like you are gaining something from the relationship.

I originally wanted a triad (I'm guessing that's what it's called feel free to correct me if I am wrong) with me and two men...and I still do, eventually. Of course things don't always go as planned... so my guy is now really crushing on this other girl. I did however, recently see a male friend of mine out of town. It was the first time I had "used my golden ticket" and had a sexual encounter with someone other than my current boyfriend. My primary has not been in an open relationship before me. So, after I got back in town there was a lot of talking and readjusting. I almost thought that my guy would change his mind about the whole poly thing and be mad at me. But we talked and talked and talked... until he was more comfortable with what I chose to do. All men are different... I'll also add that me and my guy have been talking about and researching poly ways for a few years now. So we knew it would happen. It sounds like you were hit by surprise. And that's the sucky part.

Again... I am not in your shoes so I'm just throwing thigs out there that have helped me and my guy. I hope you feel better and I hope this situation helps the two of you find out more about yourselves. Good luck.

[redpepper]

there are a few things you can do... from my experience.

embrace the jealousy and realize that it is usually a sign that you are not getting your needs met in some way. If you can figure out what that is, then you can tell her. Perhaps talking to her will get you to a place where you can figure it out. go through every idea you might have about what you think is at the route of your jealousy and see if you find something that is a need. If and when you find it then you and her can work towards it. It could just be that that will make everything fine for you.

Besides that, perhaps it's all just a bit fast. It seems to work better when people know each other and have a chance to communicate together, spend time seeing each other for who you are and what is going on for you both. Chances are he has stuff going on too.

Other than that, things take time and a whole lot of adjusting. Anyone new coming into someones life is an adjustment. This is no different but far more intense. Pace yourself and ask her to go at your pace so that you can catch up with yourself and her and begin moving forward at a pace that is suitable for both of you together.

[girlcaleb]

good note redpepper... I forgot to mention the going at your own pace thing. I learned a few years ago that time is our friend when it comes to matters of the heart. It gives you a chance to really sit back and go through all of your emotions and find out where they are coming from.

[racer812]

thank you to everyone. we talk all the time about my feelings. im just having a really hard time knowing that i am not the only one. she has been and always will be my whole life. we have talked about him, guess i should give him a name. i will call him "h". anyways we have talked about her feelings for h and they go way back to when they were both in highschool. its very hard for me to comprehend that they still have those types of feelings for each other almost 20 years later. i think my biggest issue is the whole " im gonna be replaced thing" i am told by my wife"k" that she loves the life she has with me and will always be with me. she has no intrest in leaving to start another life with h. i have told k that i would really like to meet h when he comes to our area next time. by the way they have a long distance relatioship, its about a 14 hour drive. so when they do get a chance to meet it would be for a weekend getaway. i have tried to keep my mind focused on other things but my hobbies and what little personal life i have outside of us just isnt enough. we do everything together. our hobbies, our friends, everything. like i said she is my life. sorry kinda rambled again. writing my thoughts and feelings has helped, i slept better last nite.

[DharmaBum23]

she has no plans to stop contact with him. how do the men handle the roller coaster? sorry i just kinda rambled, but i dont really have anybody to ask for advice.


First of all, the bad news. Yeah, the roller coaster sucks. You aren't crazy, that hurting is actually hurting. Also, there is a chance that your wife might leave you. This also really sucks.

Now, with that said, there is a lot of good news.

First of all, communication is going to be helpful. It sounds like you are making some good progress there. Even though they aren't poly, there are a lot of good books on communication out there.

Second, and this is only slightly less important. Find hobbies that don't involve your wife and do them. Make sure that when your wife is out with her new "significant other(SO)" that you are doing something. I cannot tell you how many times I have heard of someone who sat and stewed in their own jealousy and insecurity and when their wife/GF/whatever came home it was really messy. It doesn't have to be poly. I've heard of people who boat, write, I even know some people that use hitting people with sticks as a way to keep busy. The trick is to have a balance between knowing what you are feeling and not letting what you are feeling eat you up inside.

[redpepper]

As Dharma said before me, this is a chance to get to be YOUR whole life. Which you should be I might add. I have always subscribed to the point of view that I am my own primary. As Derby says, we often don't look after ourselves because we are unable to leave ourselves... this is no reason to get involved with yourself and have the best relationship ever.

When my husband was left while I had crazy NRE and adjustment time with Mono he decided to work on some of his life long issues. He is a completely different man as a result and far more confident, self assured, less stressed about things that come up in his life and quite frankly a better man and far more attractive. This was what he did when faced with the fact that I now had two loves that were equally as strong. What are you going to do. You can still do things that are special to the two of you together, but what is special to you and your growth?

[racer812]

thank you all for the insight and advice. i have put some of these questions to k. now just have to wait and see what happens. hopefully this will help me learn to manage my feelings better. if and when k meets h again, i think i will pack up the kids and go camping and fish. starting to get hot where i live and we can go to the mountains to cool off. again thank you for the support. its nice to now that im not the only person to have issue when things are dumped on you.

[racer812]

well had a long talk with k last nite. i still have the feeling that she is not being honest with me, and more importantly with herself. after a long discussion i am still confused about where she wants her new relationship to go. she says its just for fun, but its hard to think that its all for fun and its just friendship. its hard to comprehend when they use the "i love you" phrase when texting each other. i have told her that she needs to do some soul searching to figure out what she wants in her life. the answer i get is always the same when i ask her what she wants. she says that she wants to stay with me im am her true love and she does not want to leave our life. part of me thinks the only reason she stays is because of the kids. am i over thinking this? i know that part of my problem is the insecurity that she will leave. thats an issue that im dealing with everyday. part of me feels that this was all just dumped on me and im suppose to deal with it and be ok. part of me feels that im expected to stay home with our little ones and take care of them while shes out having fun with h for a weekend. i know that if this is goig to work that i have to learn to share. but i must admit that i am selfish when i comes to k's heart. in short i guess that im addicted to her, the way she makes me feel, her scent, her touch. sorry just kinda babbling again. i have so much goin thru my mind that its hard to put it in order. i think that the not knowing part is the worst. and knowing that what i, we, have worked so long and hard to get might fall apart. so do i just be the subservient man and let her run? or do i put my foot down and risk all that we have? at this point im not sure. perhaps i am over thinking all of this. maybe i should keep quiet and see what happens. i still dont know what h wants out of their relationship. i havent been allowed into that communication loop yet, even though i have stated the want to get to know him. guess i should be thankful that h doesnt live closer. sorry that i rambled. thank you for any insight or advice.

[groovy9]

so do i just be the subservient man and let her run? or do i put my foot down and risk all that we have?
If, by telling her you can't be happy with her loving someone else, you cause her to leave, what do you really have?

I don't know anything about your relationship, and I'm new around here (longtime lurker), so take it for what it's worth. But I do happen to have a spectacular 16-year relationship with my wife, who is exploring polyamory a bit. But she's not doing it despite me, as yours is. There is simply no way she'd do it if I wasn't completely on board. If she somehow lost her mind and did (which actually happened years ago), my foot would be all kinds of down (which it was, and she snapped right out of it.)

The point is you need to put your damn foot down. She's being four different kinds of insensitive to the guy who's supposed to be the love of her life, and she's apparently not going to snap out of it on her own.

That's not to say she can't go ahead and have a relationship with the guy, but it needs to be on both her terms AND yours.

[racer812]

thanks groovy. when she gets home tonite, i think we will talk some more. ihave been very clear about my feelings and i keep getting the same reassurance talk. it just very hard for me to accept the fact that this might be the end of a wonderful life. about a week ago i was giventhe ultimatum to get over my jealousy or get out. well ihavent gotten over it yet and im still here. i think part of her logic is if i leave that she will be free to pursue this relationship. i have done a very low thing, i read there texts. i dont feel good about the whole breach of privacy but i just had to know. very possible that this caused way more damage than good. for the most part all was as she said. txt once or twice a week. how you doin and the like. like i said earlier, i might be over thinking all of this. i was reading about compersion and i think i have experienced it before. i think alot of my problem is jealousy and insecurity. i dont know. just trying to work through this so that we are all happy. my biggest hangup is the thought of lossing her, thats the insecurity. but i keep being told the samething. maybe i should listen with my heart and not my mind.

[Ariakas]

thanks groovy. when she gets home tonite, i think we will talk some more. ihave been very clear about my feelings and i keep getting the same reassurance talk. it just very hard for me to accept the fact that this might be the end of a wonderful life. about a week ago i was giventhe ultimatum to get over my jealousy or get out.


Automatic deal breaker for me. She is being selfish, fine she wants to be poly, but you and her need to work on it as partners...this doesn't sound like a partnership to me.

Ultimatums are usually a sign of bad things, push comes to shove, not matter what you think or feel...you're screwed. She wants him, regardless of anything else in her circle.

[MonoVCPHG]

Automatic deal breaker for me. She is being selfish, fine she wants to be poly, but you and her need to work on it as partners...this doesn't sound like a partnership to me.

Ultimatums are usually a sign of bad things, push comes to shove, not matter what you think or feel...you're screwed. She wants him, regardless of anything else in her circle.

Sad to say I agree. Comments like "get over your jealousy or get out" indicate a lack of depth. If anyone says that when they supposedly love someone then clearly they use the word "Love" in a much different way than the people I know. I'm not even going to add the standard "in my opinion"...that is a bullshit statement.

[jkelly]

i guess that im addicted to her

While I'm sure that this sounds romantic to a lot of people, your writing this after emphasising earlier how she is your whole life makes it sound to me like there is something not all that healthy about your dynamic. You'd probably feel better right now if you spend some time figuring out who you are and what your life is outside of your relationship.

so do i just be the subservient man and let her run?

Er, this is a strange way of describing a (non-D/s) relationship. Do you see yourself as engaged in some sort of struggle for dominance in your relationship? Your partner should be your best ally, and you should be hers.

about a week ago i was giventhe ultimatum to get over my jealousy or get out. well ihavent gotten over it yet and im still here.

Well, this is clear, but not very helpful. I mean, it should be a clear message that something about your behaviour right now is doing catastrophic damage to your relationship (which is exactly the thing you don't want to happen). But it is a lot easier to say to someone "get over your jealousy" than it is do it. And it really isn't too much to expect that she should be your first and best resource for working through your insecurity.

She's your partner because she wants to be with you. You clearly want to be with her. Try to dial down the stuff that's damaging the relationship, ask for her help in having sane, quiet conversations on where your insecurities are, explore who you are besides just being her partner, and have some faith that you can get to a place where the relationship is going to work well again.

[TL4everu2]

Ok, I'm going to suggest that you read the book "The Ethical Slut". This book has done wonders for my wife.

There is a part in there which deals with jealousy. One of the authors said they had a issue with jealousy ones, and they asked their significant other to re-assure them that they (the sig other) wasn't going anywhere, and they would still love them (the author). My wife has done this to me since our marriage began....almost 20 years ago. She did it on a regular basis even though we weren't practicing poly yet. We didn't even KNOW about poly.....She has done this since we've been married. I, on the other hand, have not....So as we waded into this poly life, who do you think had the largest issues with jealousy? Thats right, she did. It's my own fault.....because I was lacking in my reassurance to her that I would not leave, and that I would love her eternally.

Ask her for that reassurance. Tell her that you are scared and/or nervous and most of all, WORRIED that she will leave you for him.

[skyjewel]

maybe i should listen with my heart and not my mind.

You love with the same heart that you fear with. Listen to your heart and ACCEPT that fear. Realistically speaking, your wife can and might leave you. What are you going to do to make sure that the situation does not head towards that direction?

Your wife was honest enough to admit her feelings about "H". That's one good thing. Her honesty should be met with your trust. If the way you discussed your jealousy with your wife made her react negatively, she just might start keeping things from you. You don't want that honesty to go away. You want to keep that communication channel open and positive.

Why do you think would she leave you? Do you think "H" is filling up a void in her that you're not aware of? Do you think "H" is a better lover? I'm sure you have a lot of questions of the same nature that are unanswered and this is causing your insecurity. Ask her those questions in a non-confrontational way. It will probably help if you met "H" and he himself can probably answer some of the nagging questions that are affecting you emotionally. You asked if you should put your foot down. Maybe this is the time to do so. "K" is your wife and you have every right to demand to get to know who she's spending time with. This is for your wife's safety too. It's time for the three of you to meet and have a "friendly" chat. Showing confidence about yourself and your relationship with "K" will do you good during that meeting.

Like everybody said, take care of yourself. Good luck and I hope you'll get your peace of mind.

[AliceinCyberland]

hi dazed :)

i can't completely understand what you're going thru because i'm female, but when my husband first started talking to other women online & being more serious than friends, it tore me up. i've slowly come to a point where i can accept & deal with it, but it took time, talking about it with my husband, meeting (on skype, at least) the woman he's with now & getting to know her, & work on both our parts to get there. the jealousy is very difficult to deal with- here are a couple of sites that really helped me:

http://www.serolynne.com/poly_jealousy.htm

http://www.xeromag.com/fvpolyjealousy.html

these go specifically to posts on dealing with jealousy, but there's lots of other great information too. i would suggest reading these, taking a look at your feelings, & talking to your wife about it openly & honestly. i know men have trouble with that sometimes, but i'm sure it will help. please feel free to message me if you'd like to talk, i can't imagine the initial difficulty & hurt is that much different for men & women. i feel like i went thru hell, & if i'd just thought to look for this information sooner, i could've spared myself so much pain. you've done a great thing coming on to this site & reaching out for help, to me that shows you really care about your wife's happiness :)

warm hugs, Alice

[racer812]

thankyou all for the insight. im gonna take the weekend and spend some alone time and do some serious soul searching. we have talked at length about my feelings. im still not sure that k's responces are the truth. i cant help but think that she is telling me what i want to hear and not the truth. i dont know. k is my first love and i have a hard time understanding why she and h still have, as k put it, picked up right where they left off. i did get one piece of honesty, k slept with h when we started dating. that was after we got together, i was k's first. that news didnt bother me so much, we were just starting our relationship and not living together yet. i have stated my desire to meet h, but i go back and forth as my emotions rise and fall. i read alot about compersion on this site. once i get my head together, if this doesnt fall apart, i think i will try the nike method, just do it, that i read someone else did.

[redpepper]

Is there any way you can start talking to him now? On line, call, email? something? Perhaps your fears will be dispelled if you get a sense of what is going on for him and what he wants from all this.

[SchrodingersCat]

The ultimatum bothers me. Telling someone to feel a certain way or else leave the relationship is a sad way to dump the responsibility of her choices onto you.

It's understandable that she'd want to explore this relationship, but after a 20-year investment and sounding like there's still a lot of love between you, she has some responsibility towards you to help you get through this.

Or if she's too selfish to want to help you get through this, then she has a responsibility to take accountability for ending the relationship.

She says this is just for fun, but it doesn't sound like that to me. I say so because of the ultimatum. If it was just for fun, then the difficulty you're having with it should supersede a little fun.

[racer812]

well loaded up the 5th wheel and goin to do some soul searching. ihave reread my posts and all of your guys input. last nite we discussed all of my feelings again. k says she wants a friends with benifits type of arrangement. i personally dont thing she has discussed any feelings with h. this whole thing hits me as having your cake and eating it too. k keeps rerassuring me that im the one she wants, she wants our life. the whole relationship between them is based off of a highschool sweetheart type of thing. lucky for me its a long distance relationship. from the snooping that i have done, which i feel ashamed about, h only contacts k rarely. maybe i have over thought all of this. i know that h was k first love and i have been told by others that you never forget yourfirst love. honestly k is my first love. i have never had feelings for someone like this in my life. 20 years is along time to be with someone. we have experimented in the past with other couples and have had "adventures" with a few select singles. what is happening now feels nothing like those times. maybe all of this is caused from my insecurity of losing my life partner. i dont know. i have felt compersion that i have read so much about. when we were having our "adventures" with others. it was a very exciting time, full of love and happiness. maybe this is all from me being very male and seeing h as a threat. we are after all animals with basic insticts. from what i have been told, h doesnt want to hurt our life. but this has caused a large riff between k and myself. we also discussed the ultimatum, which i was told that it wasnt an ultimatum. k told me that she feels totally drained because of my feelings and that i keep unloading on her. i told her that i wasnt unloading, that i wanted to get my feelings out in the open so that they dont consume me. so now here i am today, dropping kids off at summer camp and goin camping for a couple of days. just me and my dog. i hope this helps me. what was that caption i read, i have gone to find myself, if i return before i get back keep me here. that to me is a very true thing. well thankyou all for reading my ramblings and giving me input. wish me luck.

[redpepper]

It sounds like her point of view is that you are wrecking her good time with "unloading" your feelings onto her. In my opinion that is just too darn bad. No one ever has their cake and eats it too. At least very rarely in a poly situation. You know why? Because we have a responsibility to our other partners to listen and deal with their "unloading." Its part of the whole thing. If she thinks she can get away with not having to do so, she is sadly mistaken. If she wants you as her number one so badly then I think she is going to just have to be strong and deal. In this case she can't have it all without work. Work that most of us have to put in so we can live this way.

[Morningglory629]

It sounds like her point of view is that you are wrecking her good time with "unloading" your feelings onto her. In my opinion that is just too darn bad. No one ever has their cake and eats it too. At least very rarely in a poly situation. You know why? Because we have a responsibility to our other partners to listen and deal with their "unloading." Its part of the whole thing. If she thinks she can get away with not having to do so, she is sadly mistaken. If she wants you as her number one so badly then I think she is going to just have to be strong and deal. In this case she can't have it all without work. Work that most of us have to put in so we can live this way.

SO TRUE! Nothing worthwhile can last very long without a little work here and there...Hell I can't imagine loving without a lot of work. Growth=Hard Work=Satisfaction:D

[Breathesgirl]

hi dazed :)


http://www.serolynne.com/poly_jealousy.htm

http://www.xeromag.com/fvpolyjealousy.html



I heartily second the xeromag site, especially love the one aboke the broken refrigerator!

Thank you for the serlynne link. I've saved it and will be looking at it shortly.

[Breathesgirl]

I hope you were able to find what you were looking for this weekend :).

After reading what's been written on this thread I have learned something. Always a good thing.

I have learned that the reason I was having problems with jealousy in the beginning was because: 1. It was early in our relationship so we didn't have a good foundation to work from & 2. since it was the beginning I didn't have the reassurances I needed in order to feel secure.

I will put more in my thread so I don't hijack this one :D.

[AliceinCyberland]

glad you liked those links, BG, i found them very helpful- i hope they helped you dazed. good luck this weekend, having a little space & time to yourself can really help sort things out. :)

[SchrodingersCat]

It sounds like her point of view is that you are wrecking her good time with "unloading" your feelings onto her. In my opinion that is just too darn bad. No one ever has their cake and eats it too. At least very rarely in a poly situation.

This is beyond having your cake and eating it too. I personally think that poly already is having your cake and eating it too -- you get to express your ability and desire to love multiple people without the lies, burden and pain of cheating.

This is like... having your cake and eating it too, and then eating your husband's cake with a big shit-eating grin.

[racer812]

well, had a good weekend althought it didnt end up with me and the dog. k came out to visit and we ended up siting out under the stars and talking for a very long time. she apologized to me for the way that she has been handling my issues with her new relationship. she also told me something that really put my mind at ease, lets see if i can remember this correctly. k said that our love is not threatened because nobody cant replace me in her life, that i am the man that she wants to spend the rest of her life with and her relationship with h will never be a replacement for us or our relatonship that we have. i cant remember the exact words but the light came on, and i am feeling much better about the whole situation. i even have an email for h. i wrote him a somewhat short letter and sent it on its way.
earlier today when i was at work, k sent me a number and said i should send a text. the number is to my highschool sweetheart, wow! what a flood of emotions. so i started texting with L. i havent seen this woman in 15 years and we played catchup for most of the afternoon. i also relized that i have feelings for L, still. but the feelings(love?) is very different from what k and i have. k and i talked quickly this afternoon about L. sly woman has taught me yet again. we talked about how the feelings are different and i think we are on the proper road now. thank you to all that have given me insite and advice. i really appreciate the help. its still a little soon to tell but things are looking up.

[TL4everu2]

Awesome that you are now getting closer to being on the same page! I'm so happy for you and her! This is awesome! What a success story. (so far) I'm almost crying now. LOL

[AliceinCyberland]

wonderful!!! so glad things are looking better :)

[racer812]

well, my life is progressing towards happiness. i am learning to deal with my insecurity. K and i have had some good talks. reconnecting with my highschool gf "L" has unlocked a lot of emotions that i had locked away, part of being mono i guess. with K's help i am learning that it is possible to love someone else and not lose what k and i have. L and i have been playing catch up in our lives. i have not heard back from K's bf, but she said not to worry, he has a hard time communicating. she says he talks in circles and has a hard time conveying his true feelings. im not real thrilled with that, but i think with time and meeting face to face we can become friends. it will be difficult because H(guess i should change the letter i use for his name since H stood for HOMEWRECKER.) lives so far away, but i think with time things will improve. i still have my insecurity of K leaving, but if she was gonna do it i gave her the perfect oppurtunity. i now have a new saying " im riding this train wreck i call life to the very end of the line." haha, makes me laugh when i start getting to serious and over think things.

[NeonKaos]

How did your wife get your high school sweetie's number?

[Lost421]

I know how you feel, trust me I do. My wife came out as Poly a couple of years ago. We'd been together for 5 years before that, and when she told me she wanted to start seeing this other man she was interested, I was devastated. I won't lie to you; I hurt, I cried, I was depressed, I raged, I rode a roller coaster of emotions and the peaks were a lot smaller than the valleys. I alternated between wanting to leave her and fear of her leaving me. I never thought it would work out and I would end up alone.

It didn't work out that way at all. I told my wife how I was feeling, I made sure she knew how it made me felt. We talked, so many times, long into the night, we argued, we discussed like rational adults, we talked until our brains hurt. In short, we communicated honestly and openly about everything we were feeling. Things got easier over time. My fear of being left for 'the other man' slowly went away and although I still had (and have) jealousies and the niggling fear that any babies in our relationship may not be mine, things got easier. We negotiated some ground rules. You have a right to feel the way you feel, but you need to talk to your wife about how you are feeling. If you trust her, and she has told you that you are her life and her love, then believe her. I'm not saying there's no way she'll ever leave, hell, my wife might decide to leave tomorrow, but she's being honest with you and with herself and that's a very good sign.

I would suggest to you that you really work on figuring out how you feel, and why you feel the way you do. I would also suggest that you tell your wife when you do figure it out, and talk to her as often as you can about how you feel and what you want. Relationships are always a lot of work, and compromise is the name of the game if a relationship is going to last. You are making a compromise in sharing your wife on an emotional level, it's only fair that she be willing to make compromises for you. What works for me may not work for you, but trust me when I say that honesty and open communication is always the best policy in these situations. No doubt the road will be rough at times, but it's up to you to decide whether that road is worth it. I don't know a darned thing about you, but believe me when I say you are worth it and you are worthy of being loved, everyone deserves love.

Another thing you can do is really work on loving yourself. It's hard since our society sees self-congratulation as a conceited, but it's healthy to have self-respect and self-worth. It makes a man more attractive than a flashy car or muscles of expensive clothing, and many women have told me that. Be honest with yourself about your achievements, feel proud of the accomplishments you've made, try not to compare yourself to others. Last of all, don't believe that a poly relationship is some kind of 'unnatural' way of going through life. It's been reinforced in society that monogamy is the norm, and statistically it is, but there were times when slavery was the norm, when beating your wife was accepted and even encouraged, and look where we are now. Our society views monogamy as the norm, but that doesn't mean it's the only way to go through life and it doesn't mean it's normal. I hope you got something out of this and I have helped in some small way. You are not alone.

-Love is all you need

[racer812]

K got L number from my cousin who was in a relationship and has two kids with L's cousin. I come from a very small town so its nuthing to see old friends or be friends with ex,s and their family. K thought that if I unlocked my heart and let old feelings out that we (k and I) could work thru my issues alittle easier. Reconnecting with L has opened my eyes so to speak, I can see where K is coming from. Still have alot of work to do. The insecurity issue is the cause of my jealousy and now that i know the cause I think it will be easier to deal with. K and I know that this is a work in progress and I think if we both keep working together that over time this will be easier for me to deal with. I think that I will always have some type of insecurity or jealousy, dont think those will ever completely disappear, but with work my emotions will be much more manageable. time will tell.

[racer812]

K and I went shopping alone today, no kids. had a long discussion about her relationship, or lack there of, with H. They havent really talked, at all, about what they want. K wants to talk face to face with H and i can understand why, its a very important discussion. K is not sure what he is wanting. I told K that I think its a very good idea to find out and see if they both want the same thing. Part of me still thinks that H wants her all to himself, I do. Whether he does or not K says she is committed to me and is in this till the end. That makes me happy, but i still have that foreboding feeling that it will all end one day. Sometimes it feels like a timebomd and i cant see the timer. But for the most part things are going very well. Thankyou to all who have given advice and ideas. It has really helped finding other people that have had similiar issues in their lives.

[racer812]

Well its been a very rough week. K's whole demeanor and attidude changed dramtically. She now wants to move back home,this is also where H lives. I tried to talk to her but something has happened, I'm not sure what. So I did a little txt snooping(this is something that i hate doing, feel very ashamed) and K wants to leave me and start dating H. Her message was very straight forward and she asked him if the could start seein each other. Her feelings for me are completely different, she sees me as a friend with benifits. She also said that she never felt the spark with me that they had when they were dating. So now I sit here not sure what todo. K is planning to leave and live with a close friend, her, my kids, and the friends family. I have tried to talk to her and I seem to be making things worse, no matter how hard I try. Its so hard to watch the woman I love so completely make plans that in noway, shape, or form include me. What is happening is exactly what i was afraid of, she is in love with someone else and there seems to be nothing I can do. Well thats my story up till now. Any suggestions will help. thank you in advance.

[MonoVCPHG]

Poly is probably quite often used as a way to try to avoid ending an existing relationship after emotions change. It sounds like she isn't poly at all. Regardless, if that is how she feels about you and decided to stay would that fulfill your heart?

My ex wife once said the same things about me, it was devastating but we did manage to reconnect. If I didn't feel that her love for me was genuine, I wouldn't have been able to stay.

I don't have any advice to keep her in your life. I do know that you can find the type of love you are looking for. Where you find it is the unknown part.

Take care

[Lost421]

I really don't have much in the way of advice for you, except to tell her you love her and let her know you want her to stay. She's her own person and she'll do what she feels is best for her, and regardless of what you want you can't really change that. She may be letting NRE get the better of her (if they have only been seeing each other for a short time, she may be thinking the grass is greener on the other side. It very seldom is). There is always the possibility that she is not really poly and is using it as a way out. If she does, then I'm guessing she's really not poly after all. If she really wants to leave then sadly there's not much to be done about it. The only thing I can think to say is that if you love her, let her go. If she comes back to you, then you know it was meant to be. This is such a hard thing, and my heart goes out to you. Don't lose hope, though. This may be building up her other relationship to be more than it is. Sometimes people have to try something to realize the grass isn't always greener on the other side. I wish you the best and I hope things work out for you. If you need to talk, there are lots of great people here.

R

[racer812]

Thank you Mono and lost. Im not sure what to do. The hardest part for me is letting go. I have spent almost my entire adult life with this woman. The other hard part is going to be not having my little ones with me everyday. It wouldnt be the same if she stayed with me and I know that she only thinks of me as a friend. But I guess this will be my chance to find who I truly am. This could be the beginning of a great adventure. Dont know, Im so unsure of how to proceed. But I guess nobody ever really knows how to go forward in this situation. I was kinda thinking the same way about the nre but i dont know. The things that k says to me makes me think that she is wrapped up in the moment. The whole grass is greener thing is exactly what I was thinking. Time will tell if her new bf wants a ready made family. I have heard the if you love something let it go, if it returns to you its your to keep. Then somebody added if it doesnt return then track it down and kill it. Dont worry, Im not going to do something like that. Just think Im gonna focus on myself for a bit and get my life together.

[MonoVCPHG]

Thank you Mono. Im not sure what to do. The hardest part for me is letting go. I have spent almost my entire adult life with this woman. The other hard part is going to be not having my little ones with me everyday. It wouldnt be the same if she stayed with me and I know that she only thinks of me as a friend. But I guess this will be my chance to find who I truly am. This could be the beginning of a great adventure. Dont know, Im so unsure of how to proceed. But I guess nobody ever really knows how to go forward in this situation.

At this point, being sure of what to do is probably a bit much but you can get there my friend. When I separated from my ex wife of 17 years (my fault) I thought I was a dead man basically. I hurt in a way that I can't explain, it was death. But you know what, I made it to the other side and look at me now; in love like never before on a completely different path. But I am happy my friend. You'll get there once you chose your path.

Thinking of it as a new adventure (if that is what it comes to) is an excellent and healthy attitude :)

[racer812]

The ups and downs of my emotions are one of the hardest things to cope with. When we talk on the phone, for whatever reason, she always ends with I love you. God I love this woman with all that I am, but when I read the friends with benifits thing, my world started to crumble. K is planning a trip to take our little ones to stay with a close friend, just so happens that H lives like a mile away. Hhmm..... go figure! I think that Im gonna give K her freedom and let her see if this guy can give her what she deserves, happiness. Thats all I ever wanted for her, was her to be happy. But I have learned thru the years that you cant make someone happy, they have to make themselves happy with the choices and people that they surround themselves with. Time will tell. Maybe I will get lucky and K will come back to me, but I dont think that we will ever have the same life. Well, I thank everyone for reading and replying with personal experiences and advice, they have helped.

[racer812]

Very interesting weekend. fathers day was sunday, had a nice time with friends and my little family. Talked with K and basically told her that when she makes her trip she needs to spend time with H. The look on her face was pure astonishment. Dont think expected that from me. We talked quite abit on friday nite and saturday evening. Told her my feelings and told her that she is free to do what she thinks is right for her. During our talk on friday nite, she finally let her guard down and opened up. K hasnt been happy for about three yrs. She had planned about 2 yrs ago to leave right before christmas. So I think this latest issue is just her way of trying to justify to herself that she is done, with me and our relationship. I know that she is scared, hell Im petrified,to start over after almost 20 years together. K told me that the plan is for us to move to nevada and for me to go and drive a big rig with her best friends husband, team driving, while her the friend and all the kids stay home. I told her thats not gonna happen, Im not going to be gone from home for 3 or 4 weeks at a time and let her do whatever she wants with someone else. Told her that if she wants to go so bad that her and the kids can move, Im not going. Told her that I would give her time to see if a relationship with H is what she wants. K shot all that down, stating that she wants me and our life. I dont think she knows what she wants. I thought that if I give her time to figure out her wants, that she might choose to stay with me. But I dont know if I can get over the text mess that she sent H. I mean how many people get told after all these years that they are just a friend with benifits. What a crushing thing to say. True feelings coming to the surface? I dont know. It still hurts. Maybe with enough time the hurt will diminish. Sorry so long and scattered, my mind is working that way right now. As always thank you for reading and any comments.

[TL4everu2]

Wow...Well, this is my take on it all for now....You have given her the freedom......and like a fly, she is PETRIFIED to have total freedom. She will remain with you, if for no other reason than she is comfortable with you. I found it somewhat humorous that she wanted you to go OTR driving with a friends husband, while the two of them, sit back at home, take your money, and screw who they wish. Wow....what a life. You made the right decision by telling her "no" to that IMO.

I will agree that she probably doesn't have a CLUE what she wants.

As for the text messages thing goes, would it have hurt if you had never known about it? no....and you probably wouldn't have made the choises you have thus far either. However, you HAVE read them, and you HAVE made these choises. So....Now to move FORWARD, and quit rehashing the past. Learn form the past, and don't make the same "mistakes" you have in the past.

If you REALLY wish to stay in a relationship with K, then tell HER that. If, however, you DON'T wish to, you need to tell her that as well.

[racer812]

Thank you TL. You are absolutely right, i must get over the past. I must move forward with my life, whether K wants to be apart of it or not. I am looking into changing my career, Im so unhappy where Im at now, and Im making plans for mine and my kids future. We talked for alittle bit last night and I told her that it is her choice what she is going to do, Im not gonna beg her to stay. Also told her that I want to stay here because of opurtunities and our friends, that there is nothing for me in nevada but pain and probaly worse. I think that it would be a slow and painful death to our relationship. So here I sit typing on the computer, watching my little ones play, wondering what the future holds. Im not sure what to expect, but Im fairly confident that I will survive and grow with this life lesson.

[TL4everu2]

Im not sure what to expect, but Im fairly confident that I will survive and grow with this life lesson.I guarantee you that you will survive, and you will learn. I honestly hope things work out for the both of you. I got so lucky to have found my wife so early on in life. I have had the pleasure of growing up with her for the last 20 years. (I am 39 now...wow...the big 4 oh this year...Oh well...Time waits for no-one) If I can be of any help, just ask. If I am hindering you at all, just let me know, and I'll butt out. ;)

[racer812]

not butting in at all. My wife and I have been together for 20 years. I will be 39 next month. I feel that we can work this out, I want to work this out. But I must be patient and let K figure out what she wants from her life. So I have mentally prepared myself for the worst, and hoping for the best. I think that is all I can do now, hurry up and wait. Thank you for the insight and suggestions.

[TL4everu2]

not butting in at all. My wife and I have been together for 20 years. I will be 39 next month. I feel that we can work this out, I want to work this out. But I must be patient and let K figure out what she wants from her life. So I have mentally prepared myself for the worst, and hoping for the best. I think that is all I can do now, hurry up and wait. Thank you for the insight and suggestions.Yes, waiting is the hardest part. Try to remain positive. If you think and harp on the worst, it will come to pass. If you think and harp on the best case scenario, then you will find a way to make it happen. ;) The universe will give you everything you request if you know how to ask for it. The way to ask for it, is to believe it wholeheartedly. If you think (even a little) that she will leave, then she likely will....why?? Because you believe she will. Have faith in the universe, and allow the cards to fall where they will. Focus on your children and making them happy. ;)

[idealist]

I did volunteer work in grief recovery for 5 years. I had a good friend who had been married for 30 years. Her husband had an affair and left the marriage. My friend still loved her husband, but forced herself to move on with her life. I was part of her life during that process of 7 years as she spread her wings and focused on herself for a while instead of her husband, children, the house etc......She even re-married, but her heart wasn't really in it. She never completed the property settlement with her ex and her new husband had a big problem with that. They fought over that and other things and ended up splitting up after one year. Then, her ex husband came back to her. It was what she really wanted. They have re-married and (since they never sold the house) are living back in the house that they raised their children in and lived in for 30 years. She is glad all of that happened because she is happier now and has learned how to have an identity outside of her husband while still being with him. She says she would not have been able to do it without the time alone.

[racer812]

Its very hard to focus on the positive at this moment. I learned today that the plant that I work at will be shutdown for the week after the 4th of july. This is the same week that K is planning a trip to nv. I called and told her about the shutdown, basically Im not invited on her trip.:(. So i sit here alone at the moment trying to find the positive in this, so far its not working. So now I will have a week to myself, this is after we get back from our family vacation to a cabin in the mountains. I think I need to find someone:rolleyes:, I mean something to do. If I sit at home for the week I will go completely crazy, so now I must find things to keep my over active mind from dwelling on the negative. Think Ill try fishing with my friends and see if that helps. I have been talking with my highschool sweetie "L" and she knows what is going on in my life. L is in a very bad marriage and will not leave her terrible situation. We have talked about why women will stay in an unhappy marriage. Im sure that the reason is different for everybody, but I dont know for sure. Thank you all for the words of encouragement, they do help. Im gonna think positive and "see" K staying with me happily.;)

[TL4everu2]

Dazed,
I know it's difficult. Do you have any hobbies that might occupy your mind while she is away? I know I like working on my 67 Mustang. It helps me to think about something else and keeps me busy.

Sitting in an empty house masturbating does not count as a "hobby". LOL But on a more serious note....Maybe while she is gone, you might think about going out with some friends. Not just fishing...but go out to a club or go out roller skating, or bowling, or to a movie. Maybe invite your old sweetie out to a movie. (The new karate kid movie is a decent one) It can be completely innocent and doesn't have to go anywhere. Just a couple old friends out to the movies. Basically, go out and ENJOY yourself.

Don't try to ignore the thoughts of K while she is gone....Try to think of how much you love her, and want her to be happy in whatever choices she makes.

[redpepper]

YAY.. you time! I get that this weekend as Nerdist is off to visit roly. I can't wait to have the house to myself and have many plans. :) look to the positive my friend, it's just a week, a week to get to know and hang out with the one you should love the most. Yourself! What an opportunity!

[racer812]

Those are all excellent ideas TL. Unfortunately L doesnt live anywhere close by:(. Although I have asked her if she wants to come visit;). But seriously its just to hot down here for me to go ride and camp. So I think I"ll call some friends and go out to a club, haven't done that without K in ages! I'm planning on keeping myself busy and I might be able to go and do a side job to help keep me focused on the positive. I talked with K last nite and this morning, she still says I'm the one she wants, she wants to stay here with me. Perhaps I am so focused on the negative and my insecurities that I'm not listening with my heart. At the time that I read the text,K says she was exploring her options. So I'm gonna stay focused on the positive and make sure that I'm in the right frame of mind and in a good place in my life and let K make her choice. I will be a supportive and positive part of her life, no matter what her choices are. Again I thank everybody that has given me advice and insight into your lives. Thank you all.:)

[redpepper]

yup, stay positive and look after you. It's far more attractive I think. More becoming on a person when they are confident, positive and getting on with it.... :)

[racer812]

So, just as I was getting settled into my "new" life,K hits me with moving! Not to nevada like I thought, but into a new house. Wow I didnt see this coming. We have been looking for a house on and off for the three years we have been here. She found a great home with property and a very nice backyard, a patio for bbq's and all the things we like to do. K asked me to look at it with her and we did. She asked my opinion about the home, I said that I really like it. I then asked K if she wanted to make that kind of commitment to our relationship and family. Lets face it, buying a home is not something that you walk away from. K still stands by her statement of being committed to me. As I sit here trying to put my thoughts to paper so to speak, I have realized that never did tell K to stop her relationship with H. K on the other hand never offered to stop contact with him either. Funny that I didnt put that "ultimatum" out there. I guess, even though we are still working towards being happy, I never blamed H for our problems. The problems have been mine and K's. Probly alittle more mine than hers, but this whole thing has been a learning process for me. Finding myself and dealing with my insecurity, my depression. My future will be very interesting to say the least.:cool:

[TL4everu2]

See? Positive thinking at work already. ;) Good luck and keep us informed.

[racer812]

Well, we are getting closer to our family getaway on the fourth. My little family and some friends are going to the mountains for the weekend. I think this will be fun for all of us and hopefully a good stress relief. I plan on taking the week off from work to spend some quality time with me. Thank you TL your comment made me laugh. At least my sense of humor is still working properly, well its proper for me:D.

[ragtagjesus]

i'm totally new here so i won't offer you advice but just wanted to say that i'm in a similar situation. wife has developed feelings for her ex that she was involved in when she was 16. (she is 39 now). feeling conflicted about the emotional relationship they have even though there is as yet no physical relationship between them.

i do agree that communication is key. my wife and i talked all night last night and it was really uncomfortable and scary but ultimately i think we were able to reconnect after feeling some distance and be totally honest about some stuff.

it sounds like you and your wife also talk openly about your feelings which is good.

i struggle with co-dependency so for me, this is especially hard to stay present and be honest and be ok with "me".

so, i feel for you and just know that you aren't alone.

[racer812]

Thanks ragtag.MY wife "K" didnt develope feelings for her ex. They rekindled them after finding each other on facebook. They have already had one weekend together, I'm still dealing with insecurity issues from that, and now have another weekend planned. My life has been an utter rollercoaster. I think that Im just now, MAYBE, getting use to the idea. It still hurts. I have thought about tryin the local swingers scene, but I think its just a band aid at the moment.I need to take time and focus on myself, my health, both mental and physical, and try to have a backup plan just incase. I have been trying very hard to focus on the positives of my situation. I think it is helping. Heres something that happened to me earlier today. A very good female friend of mine, who I have flirted with thru out the years, and knows about our problems, says to me " wouldnt it be a trip if you and I ended up together after this?" WOW! My mind went in circles, squares, triangles and whatever other shapes popped in there. I said to her, you have know idea what thoughts of you have gone thru my mind. We laughed and continued our talk. It made me feel good to know that Im still attractive to the other sex. Lol! Oh well, needless to say it will be very interesting around here for sometime to come. To all that read this and if it applies to you, have a happy and enjoyable 4th.:)

[racer812]

Well, made it back home after our family vacation just to turn around and let K and the kids drive away. Monday nite was terrible. Had an argument with K about her trip and her plans, and then woke up to my poor old dog having a seizure. Its been a long day to say the least. So I sit here wondering if I have done the right thing. I set my wife free and now I need to concentrate on myself. I need to make sure that my mind is in a good place, no matter what happens. I'm still having my insecurity issues, but they are getting better.

[electra]

I have enjoyed reading through this thread, lots of good replies andd useful information from those more experiened. OP, one thing that occured to me in one of your posts is, you said your wife tol you she has been unhappy for 3 years, an was thinking of leaving 2 years ago. This was prior to her rekindled feelings for the other guy? Seems like this goes back further an it would be helpful to know why she has been unhappy. I would writee more but my laptop kys are stiking an its vrey slow for me to type. I wish you th bst of luk an am sorry for th pain you'v been going through.

[racer812]

Basically K has been unhappy since we moved to Arizona. I have been battling depression since we moved here. This is very hard country to make a living. The place that K works is right in the middle of a poverty stricken area. Her job is very stressful. I have been working on my depression and the lack of work or very low paying jobs. So it has been no picnic here. We have had many discussions about moving, but its so hard for K to give up her career. And the place she wants to move to is basically right next to H. I'm still not comfortable with this idea. Thats where K is this week. Visiting with friends and checking her options so to speak. I'm patiently waiting for her return. From K's actions, I'm pretty sure she wants to stay with me. We are in the process of getting a house here and I'm looking into a better job. I usually work in construction, but that has pretty much died, so I have been plying my skills do other work. K feels that she doesn't have any friends here, but thats not true, she just won't let anyone get close to her. Not sure where all this is going, but I'm in it till the end.

[racer812]

Ok, update time. Not sure were to start. K came home to me. Everything seems to be going good. K seems happy with my new direction and is making plans to stay here with me. Theres only two small things that are bothering me, one K changed her Facebook profile from married to its complicated and two, she spent some time with H and didn't give me a courtesy call. We have always practiced the the courtesy call. Other than that everything seems to be going well. At the end of this month when we go and retrieve the little ones, I will finally get to meet H. So I think we are on the road to healing. Thank you to all of you that have posted, it all has helped me understand and deal with my emotions.

[TL4everu2]

Hmmm....Seems as though some posts may be missing here now. I KNOW that one of the ones I put on here is now gone...as well as a couple others. Interesting. I really detest sites where mods or admins feel the need to censor things. Hope thats not what happened here.

[Ariakas]

Hmmm....Seems as though some posts may be missing here now. I KNOW that one of the ones I put on here is now gone...as well as a couple others. Interesting. I really detest sites where mods or admins feel the need to censor things. Hope thats not what happened here.

Was it split out into its own thread? I know the mods here do not like to remove posts ever, as they could help people in the future :)

[TL4everu2]

I don't know what happened exactly. The posts I'm refering to were very specific to this thread though.....but meah. Just an oddity. I thought I broke the internet again. :D

[redpepper]

I really don't know what happened to your posts TL4. I definitely don't want that kind of control over what goes on here. I have no interest in silencing anyone or censor anyone. It goes against my values big time!

another note: we have 7 pages here. Anyone feel like tagging? I would hate for this thread to get missed in a search later on.. thanks, I just don't have the time right now :D

[racer812]

The more I think about my current situation, the more I see wrong with it. I have been trying very hard to understand her relationship with H. But it seems to me that I'm the on only one who is sacrificing anything. H, as far as I know, hasn't had to do anything. K hasn't had to change anything, she hasn't stopped talking or making plans with H. I feel like I'm the only one who is compromising everything.
K and I talked a little about her visit with H. It didn't sound to me like it went very well for her. K said they only spent a couple of hours together. I asked her if they had intercourse, she said that they didn't. K's reason was because she was afraid that I would freak out and have another meltdown. Seems like a pretty flimsy reason to me.
I still don't understand why, if I mean so much to her, she continues to stay in contact with H. I also haven't made the request for her to stop talking with him. Funny!? I think for me, if I ask or tell her to stop, she would do it anyways.
Is the connection for your first love, who you have had no contact with for almost 20 years, that strong? My connection to my first love is so strong that I am willing to make myself miserable just to keep her in my life. HHMMMM..... I will have to think about this some more.

[jkelly]

But it seems to me that I'm the on only one who is sacrificing anything.

It shouldn't be a competition. If you are partners, things that add to her life add to yours, too.

Plus, all this stuff you're going through; facing your insecurities and jealousy, communicating hard feelings, negotiating, etc. are you developing skills that will make you better at relating to people, in all aspects of your life.

I asked her if they had intercourse, she said that they didn't. K's reason was because she was afraid that I would freak out and have another meltdown. Seems like a pretty flimsy reason to me.

I agree with you -- that does sound like a bad reason not to sleep with someone.

I still don't understand why, if I mean so much to her, she continues to stay in contact with H. I also haven't made the request for her to stop talking with him. Funny!?

Presumably she continues to stay in contact with H because that relationship also means something to her. I don't think it's at all funny that you haven't requested that she stop talking to him; that would be very sad, and not funny at all.

My connection to my first love is so strong that I am willing to make myself miserable just to keep her in my life.

If that is really the best description of where things are at, you probably shouldn't do that. People shouldn't stay in relationships that make them miserable! But look, people who have had the kind of reaction that you are having have come out the other side with better, happier relationships in the end and wouldn't want to go back. A "connection" won't get you there, but doing the work that you need to do to will.

[racer812]

Thanks jkelly. I'm still have problems dealing with my emotions. I have requested three times now to meet H. Nothing has happened yet. I mean, if the guy is that special to K, to risk everything that she has to keep him apart of her life, I want to meet him. When we travel to retrieve the little ones, I told K that it would be the perfect time for the three of us to meet and greet so to speak. I think that if I can meet H it will help put my mind at ease, I hope. Its getting hard to talk with K about my feelings, she says that all she wants is a friend with benefits. But I feel like I'm only getting part of the answer. Sorry, just kinda rambling on.
K is still affectionate to me, tells me she loves me, tells me that I'm her life. I guess I should learn how to let go of my negativity and trust K and listen to my heart more. Kinda hard for me to do, I'm to logical, it might be in my genetic makeup(LOL). I still have my good days and my bad days. The good ones are starting to out weigh the bad. Maybe the light will come on all of the sudden and life will once again be grand.

[MonoVCPHG]

I have requested three times now to meet H. Nothing has happened yet. .

Some one is living in denial. Sounds to me like her ex isn't cool with the sharing thing and so has chosen to avoid the reality that his girlfriend has a husband. If they are not willing for you two to meet I would be a little apprehensive...maybe a bit more than a little.

Take care
Mono

[racer812]

Thank you mono. I just had a thought hit me while I was packin up for the move. If K's relationship is as she states, "just for fun." why is she fighting so hard to keep this guy in her life? I, for one, would drop( hell I have!) a casual hookup in a heart beat if K said she was uncomfortable with the "relationship". I know in my heart that there is more to her relationship with H than she's telling me. I'm very torn on what to do. Every time I try to talk with her about their relationship I get the same answer," its just fun."
The inner turmoil is getting out of control.....................turning............... ...green...........................RRRRRRRR!!!
Just kidding! Sorry no gamma rays from my time in the nevada desert.
Its a very frustrating feeling. I dont think I'm getting the full answer. Or maybe I'm over thinking again and trying to get the answer(s) that I want to hear.
Note to self, your mind is a tangled web of emotions and feelings not always entirely in your control.
Theres gotta be other monos that have gone thru something similar. When, if it has, did it "click" for you? I understand that it takes time, but it should be something that we both work on, together.
I had a talk with a female friend of mine, she knows a good portion of what is going on, and she said that she had so much guilt built up that she turned everything back on her ex so that she would feel better about leaving him. I wonder if thats part of whats going on?
I made the offer to K to stop the house purchase and move to nevada, where she wants to be, she and the kids could live in a house there and I would go over the road. Would only be home once a month or so. K didnt like that idea, asking what about my happiness. I told her my happiness comes from her being happy. Needles to say we aren't moving to nevada.
Well time for more packin and thinkin. thank you for any insite or advice.

[MonoVCPHG]

" its just fun."

Nobody puts someone they love through what you are going through "just for fun" in my experience. That disturbs me a little. So if that is a two way street for both of them...does that mean your wife is a play toy? If that works for her and you then so be it I guess.



When, if it has, did it "click" for you? I understand that it takes time, but it should be something that we both work on, together.

Sorry my friend. I am the "other man". When my ex-wife asked to open up our marriage it didn't click for me at all in the end. My perspective is much different than yours. Put in your shoes I would react differently I'm sure. But you are not me so that means nothing really.

I told her my happiness comes from her being happy. .

I hope you have seriously internalized what that could mean for you down the road my friend. That is a big red door to fling open. Your health has to be a priority here as well. People who are unhealthy end up doing some pretty fucked up shit...Take it from some one who's been there.

Be honest, be compassionate, be true to yourself, and be strong.

[redpepper]

Have you thought of contacting him yourself dazed? Could you not ask her for his email address of number? Why shouldn't you take this into your own hands if you want to meet him? I can't see why not. I make my men plan their own meetings together. They need to have their own relationship outside of me. I have always done it like that. I don't need to be involved. I think its better that way. They come back from hanging out all chummy and brotherly. It is so rewarding to see them working on their relationship.

[jkelly]

If they are not willing for you two to meet I would be a little apprehensive...maybe a bit more than a little.

I agree with Mono about this part. You are making a smart, and maybe a little challenging for you, request that a lot of people who have experience with this strongly encourage, and you're getting resistance instead of having that kind of willingness to do the work encouraged. That's some serious polyfail.

I just re-read the whole thread and I think that there's something a little... complicated about what's going on here. It's been said before, but you really shouldn't be doing all the heavy lifting here.

There needs to be some distinction between your expressing your feelings and your asking for things that really will make things work out better for everyone. I think that there should be some conversation where you get to say "I wish you weren't doing this. If you are going to do this, please do a better job of it. I have been doing a lot of reading and listening about this, and here is some stuff I have learned that I want you to make use of, because everyone's life will be better if you do."

That may be really difficult to convey properly, because it may be hard to separate requests to stop from requests to do things better. But the situation right now is that you are both trying to deal with something that you don't want to be happening, and also be the person who is learning about how this is actually supposed to work. If anything is unfair about this situation, it is that, and I wouldn't expect anyone to be very happy about being in that position.

[MonoVCPHG]

polyfail.

.

I've just added this to my internal dictionary. I'm not sure if you came up with the term, but thanks regardless :)

[TL4everu2]

HOLY CRAP! I've just realized that "DazedandConfused" is a different person than "dazedandlost". LOL THAT clears up some things. :rolleyes:

[jkelly]

I'm not sure if you came up with the term, but thanks regardless :)

As far as I know, that was coined by my ex-girlfriend. It's sort of a shame how useful it is.

[racer812]

I was thinking that this thread should probably be moved to life stories and blogs, I have a tendency to use it as a way to get my feelings out.
I talked to a friend of mine today for like an hour on the phone. He has gone thru something similar to what I have going on. His wife got in contact with her ex, and within three months(right about know for me) she moved out, because she wasn't "happy". This all sounds way to familiar. He had a friend of his go thru the same thing about six months ago( I see a pattern). It worked out for both guys in the end, the wives came back to them. Grass wasn't greener after all. So with this new info, I think that I'm gonna try to insist on meeting H and then sit back and wait. Not sure if the waiting part is the smartest choice, I have a serious lack of patience sometimes, but I have learned thru the years that once a woman makes up her mind she's gonna do what she wants, when she wants. I am trying to think of a way to bring up the subject without K getting defensive, small chance. I also have realized that I'm letting this thing with H hang over my head, as in, be extra good or else. Feels like an ultimatum. Never have been able to deal with ultimatums very well, I tend to do exactly the opposite of what is wanted. This has been a huge learning experience for me. I hope K has been learning too. I found some info about the poly life and printed a copy for K to read, she doesn't think she is poly. She could be right, but I know in my heart that she has feelings for H, whether she will admit it or not. Why else would she fight so hard to keep him and risk what she has here at home. Well theres my thoughts and feelings for today. Thank you all for reading and giving me ideas and insight, it has helped.

[racer812]

I think its time to change my name on this forum. With all of the advice and incite that I have received from all of you wonderful people, I have grown and learned. As such I am no longer dazed or lost. I have a direction and a purpose.
I am now focused on finding a happy ground with K and H. K has been very attentive for the last few weeks. I also have been keeping most of my thoughts to myself, she says she is tired of going thru the same thing with me, over and over again. I told her tuff! I will bring up my concerns and feelings anytime I feel like Im be pushed out or neglected.
After I talked to my friend "J" yesterday, I spent alot of time deep in my thoughts(sometimes its scary). I have decided that this weekend when K is off of work we will sit down(or I will tie her to the bed, just kiddin) and talk about her true feelings for H, good or bad. I know that there is more to her relationship than she is telling me. Perhaps she is doing this to "protect" me. I would much rather have the truth, no matter how much it might hurt. At least knowing the truth, I wouldnt wonder where I stand with K.
I think I will change my screen name to poly?quad. I dont think I'm poly, never know though, staying open minded here. I love to ride and race my quad. Nothing like the camaraderie and competition when racing thru the desert at break neck speeds.
So if anybody reads this, let me know what you think of the new handle. Also open to any suggestions. Thanks for reading and posting.

[TL4everu2]

I only have one thing to say:

If you go with the screen name "poly?quad", you may get ppl thinking you are in a quad relationship. ;) Just something to think about.

[racer812]

LOL! I'm not sure what a quad relationship is. Is that where all for are involved?
I'm not even sure if the relationship that I have with the wife and hers with the bf is truly a V.
I could go with my racing number.812, except you have to say each number separately as in ate one too. I have had that number for alot of years!

[Ariakas]

quad is just 4...:)...2 couples...1 guy 3 girls...etc. :)

[redpepper]

quad is just 4...:)...2 couples...1 guy 3 girls...etc. :)

Quads seem to be, more often than not, two couples coming together. Although it seems that often the men are not sexually involved, which I never understood as a true quad, as to me, all would be involved.

[Ariakas]

Quads seem to be, more often than not, two couples coming together. Although it seems that often the men are not sexually involved, which I never understood as a true quad, as to me, all would be involved.

Like a triad vs a V :)

if two couples got together and the guys werent involved...what would that be?...overlapping V...haha...

I think for simplicity I just say quad is 4. instead of the double triad idea. :)

[racer812]

:confused:????? Um....... I think that I'm more confused now than before! A quad relationship, in my opinion, would be, all involved with each other, mf,ff,mm,mfmf,mmf,ffm...............and it goes on and on and on. A triad would be three involved with each other. So if I change my screen name I don't think I will use poly?quad, to confusing.
I'm thinking.......................................... ............... hold on still thinking............this might take awhile............................................ .polywog! Actually that is a name I have heard that was used to describe tadpoles, baby frogs. The tadpole then changes, metamorphosis, into a frog. I think that I'm changing,with my situation being as it is, learning to accept my wife for who she truly is. Hhhhhmmmmm.......Now how do I change my screen name without losing everything that I have posted? Any suggestions?

[redpepper]

Sorry, I really have no idea. I know people have done it.... I like polywog though :)

[TL4everu2]

Yes, I like polywog also. I think you have to e-mail a site admin.

[racer812]

thanks gang. i think i will do that as soon as i figure out how to do that.

[racer812]

Now I have a new screen name, and I am focused on what I want. I must admit that I'm not entirely sure how to get what I want but things have been progressing to happiness.
Had a great talk with K, she finally admitted her feelings for H:). Now I just have to learn to control my insecurities and learn compersion(it will take time).
Making the trip to get my little ones and finally meet her bf.
I think my life is turning around(finally!). I dont want to jinx it so I am trying to patiently wait(hard for me, I see what I want and go get it!).
So here is a huge thank you to all who have posted on this thread and given me advice and insight. I will keep posting and keep you all informed of my progress.
THANK YOU!!!!

[redpepper]

Here's to your new name *clink* new name, new beginnings? Here's hoping that things are looking up! :)

[MonoVCPHG]

Best of luck my friend :)

[Morningglory629]

:D Yea for you!

[racer812]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WHAT THE F**K!!! What is this? One step forward, two steps back! I don't f**k get this. Now, outta the blue, the whole plan has changed! I was told that I will not meet H! K has decided that I am not ready to meet her bf! Talk about a kick in the nuts! I am so hurt and angry right now! I wanna break something! I have been trying so hard to come to grips with my emotions, and all I asked was one simple little thing! Now, I'm back to square one! This is total bullshit! I'm so frustrated with how I have been treated during this whole mess. I feel like I don't matter. K is gonna keep seeing H no matter what I say or do! We ended up having a HUGE argument last night! All because she is unwilling to help me understand why this dickhead is so important to her. And to top it all off, K is back to the " he's just a friend" crap! I asked her why is he so important, why risk all you have for a "friend"? I don't get it! when we were swinging, there was one lady that made K uncomfortable with the whole situation, K asked me to stop and I did! I ask her to stop and I get a big FUCK OFF!!! This emotion of love really sucks! Wish I could turn it off and walk away! So, it looks like I get to stay home again, while K goes and fucks this douche bag! I'm so done with this whole thing. I think its time to explore the "other" option. I don't know what else to do. I still feel like i'm the only one having to make a change, to be ok with this. UGH!! I need a bottle!

[MonoVCPHG]

I don't know what else to do.

Set her free. AKA..dump her and find someone who deserves you or at least has the emotional maturity to sustain one relationship.

[Breathesgirl]

I agree with Mono on this one. You've done your best & it seems like your best isn't good enough for her:(.

Let him have her and give yourself a break from the drama, get your head (& your heart) on straight again and then see what there is in this big ole pond that piques your interest.

[TL4everu2]

You've done your best & it seems like your best isn't good enough for her:(.

I disagree. Racer has done his/her best....It is good enough, yet not accepted. Eitehr way, the result is the same. Oddly enough, I had this same conversation today with one of my ex-students. (I used to teach her and her lover martial arts) There comes a time, when a person has to ask themselves if the relationship is worth the trouble. If it is, shut up and keep trying and quit griping. If not, then bite the bullet, grow a pair, and cut them off. Period. You already know what you need to do.....Now do it.;)

[racer812]

I'm not ready to give up! I have been beat down worse than this! TL those are pretty harsh words, but you do have a point. Thanks. If this marriage is destined to end then it will be K that walks away, not me! I can't(won't) walk away.K must make her choice, whether its good or bad for me!

[redpepper]

I think it just needs more time. She is confused and scared it seems to me and things are moving too fast for her now. Go at the pace of the one struggling the most I always say.

She seems to be struggling. Why not check with her. Ask her if she is struggling with the idea of having the two of you come together. I was terrified and elated all at the same time when Mono and Nerdist met the first time. I can understand that. Perhaps she doesn't think it's worth it and doesn't see it as being worth it to her because she is unsure if he is worth it to her.

Maybe she is losing interest and you are now making it out to be bigger than she now feels.... way to make your wife mono again! Be a super supportive husband that gives her the space to grow and learn and find others and be who she wants to be and then sit back and wait for her to figure out that what she thought she didn't have she actually had all along and it was just lost!

I'm just joking, but you never know right!? If nothing else you have the comfort and pride of knowing you have been doing the best you could possibly do by her and as a result yourself.

[Karma13]

Isn't she just scared that you will kill him?

[TL4everu2]

I'm not ready to give up! I have been beat down worse than this! TL those are pretty harsh words, but you do have a point. Thanks. If this marriage is destined to end then it will be K that walks away, not me! I can't(won't) walk away.K must make her choice, whether its good or bad for me!But are you willing to be abused in the process of waiting for her to leave? :confused:

[racer812]

LMAO! Karma that made me laugh! You have a very valid point, as much as the caveman in me( his name is grog) wants to do just that, the more sensible part of me wants to meet and get to know this guy. Part of me wants to meet the guy who is so "special" that K is willing to go through all of this. Grog just wants to SMASH!

TL, if it means that I get to keep my true love, I am willing to take alot more punishment. I have been through alot of pain, mental and physical, in my life. Started in childhood and has continued. I have been mentally and physically abused by my mother(we don't talk), I have healed from those wounds, have the scars to prove it! I learned to walk again after shattering my leg. I deal with rheumatoid arthritis every day( I have bad knees, both need replaced). So, yes I will endure what ever it takes. I never quit(glutton for punishment?)!

RP, you made a point that I have not thought about. K is probably scared. I think back to when we were swingin and I always made sure that my new "partner" met K. I was always nervous! I think you have some great insight. I will try my best to give K more time to sort out her feelings.:confused:

Thank you all again. I do value your input and insight.

[racer812]

Well, sent K on her way to retrieve my little ones. Now I'm trying very hard to keep busy so I don't dwell on my thought(have a bad tendency to do that).
K was very quiet this morning. I helped her pack for her trip, slipped some protection, a card, and my wedding band into her bag. Nothing special about the card, just a remember me romantic one, the wedding band is to hopefully reminder of how much she means to me, the protection is for her to use if she see's H.
I hope this doesn't back fire:eek:. I'm sure that she will call me when she gets to NV and unpacks.
It might have been a big mistake doing that, but............:confused:.

[TL4everu2]

Ummm.....In MY opinion, if my wife were to put her wedding ring in my suit case when I went on a trip like this one, I would take that as her telling me she wants to break up. But thats just me. I certainly wouldn't take it as a reminder to think about her.

Unfortunatly, we can not turn back the hands of time, and what you've done, is already done. When she calls, tell her why you put the ring in there BEFORE she gets a chance to ask about it. Just my .02

[Ariakas]

Ummm.....In MY opinion, if my wife were to put her wedding ring in my suit case when I went on a trip like this one, I would take that as her telling me she wants to break up. But thats just me. I certainly wouldn't take it as a reminder to think about her.

haha...actually ya, I might take it that way too. I am not overly connected to my ring, but I know Pengrah is. If I saw her ring in the luggage I would assume she was sending me a very strong message.

Hopefully she reads the letter first and understands the context first :)..best of luck.

[racer812]

When all of this started and I thought she wanted to leave, I handed her my ring. It was immediately given back to me! K keeps telling me that I am the one she loves, I am the one that she wants to be with, I am her life. Then why must she keep H in her life? Why is she willing to risk all that we have? What is so damn important about him?

Perhaps I need to listen. Perhaps I'm too mono. I still have my insecurities, being pushed out, being replaced. The thought of K having an emotional connection on the level that we do..........................

Maybe I am still over thinking all of this. Maybe I'm making a mountain out of a mole hill. I think patience and communication are the keys to my issues. We have a great level of communication, we can talk about anything. Patience is not one of my strongest qualities. But having kids has sure helped me learn patience.;).

Now you all have me worried:(! The card and the ring are in the envelope together, so there shouldn't be any questions. I will have to wait til K calls me tonite, now I'm crossin my fingers!

[FormerUnicorn]

I hope things go well for you. I'd be extremely freaked out if my husband sent me his wedding ring with a card that says "remember me."

Maybe it'll shake some sense into her.

[Ariakas]

When all of this started and I thought she wanted to leave, I handed her my ring. It was immediately given back to me! K keeps telling me that I am the one she loves, I am the one that she wants to be with, I am her life. Then why must she keep H in her life? Why is she willing to risk all that we have? What is so damn important about him?


You have to learn to trust her, hard I know :)


Perhaps I need to listen. Perhaps I'm too mono. I still have my insecurities, being pushed out, being replaced. The thought of K having an emotional connection on the level that we do..........................


Honestly, it isn't a video game. I hear this magical level thing people bring up. I fell in love with our ex. It was intense but it is not the same love I feel for my wife. It just isn't.

Is there an measurable intensity difference, sure why not. But intensity isn't the only measure of love (in fact I explain below how, imo, it is partially love). Trust, length of term etc are all that as well. Take heart in what YOUR love means to the two of you. You are not in love at level 15 ;) Her lover, with anyone else, will never be the love she has with you :)

Whoever I fall in love with will receive my love. However it doesn't remove how I love Pengrah or what that loves means to me in time and lessons learned.

One thing I do see a lot of people confusing are the differences between lust and love. The raw unadulterated need to fuck and enjoy the NRE that occurs is not love. They overlap sooo perfectly that they are easy to confuse, but they are easily recognizable when any of the other pairing leaves.

I can't count how many times I have considered being in love with someone, was riding the NRE wave and trust me on this, I am extremely lustful, it is my most enjoyable sin :cool:. Once the lust and the nre started to wear off, I realized THAT was the extent of the relationship.

I am not saying this will happen with your overall situation, but when the wave is on, you may be looking at THAT intense fire right in the face :)


Maybe I am still over thinking all of this. Maybe I'm making a mountain out of a mole hill. I think patience and communication are the keys to my issues. We have a great level of communication, we can talk about anything. Patience is not one of my strongest qualities. But having kids has sure helped me learn patience.;).

Patience is a virtue that does not mesh well in my head. Its been a battle and a fight to learn how valuable patience is. I am 35 and learning this lesson now. I have a dutiful teacher which helps :)

[racer812]

Thank you Ariakas. The more I think about this whole situation, the more I see how much I need to learn.
Its a very difficult thing to trust when it comes to matters of the heart, at least for me it is. So, I sit here and "trust" in the fact that she loves me and will come back to me.
I guess I should be thankful that it is a LDR. If it is a relationship at all. If H lived closer, I dont think I would still have K.

[TL4everu2]

If H lived closer, I dont think I would still have K.Then you don't really "have" her anyway. Just sayin.:(

[racer812]

Thats very possible. But I'm not gonna stop loving her, even if she decides to leave. What I meant by that is, during our arguments, if he lived closer, she probably would have run to him, but I'm not entirely sure.
I'm trying to be patient and wait but I was never very good at it. So I am keeping myself busy so that I don't have time to dwell on the negative, trying to stay focused on the positive. I'm not even sure if K is going to see H. But if she does, we went over our rules again,together, and I hope it works better this time for all of us.
I still don't understand myself in the fact that I haven't told K that she had to stop her "relationship" with H. I know deep down that she will not give him up so to speak until she is ready. Strange how I can accept part of the relationship and not the other.

[racer812]

I received a call from K this morning, we almost always text. She was very emotional about my card and ring. She was so touched.
And as of this morning she is excited to get back home to me! Life is slowly turning around. I'm not gonna rush any of this, its time to sit back and wait.:p

[Breathesgirl]

I'm glad she took your gesture the way you meant it :).

It sounds like she's thinking, from more recent posts of yours, like she's thinking the grass is always greener when she's with the other person.

Maybe ask him (I think it's you that's facebooking with your s/o's other) if that's how he thinks she's thinking of it. When with you she's always thinking about what it's like with him & when with him always thinking about how it is with you. Ask her about it as well. That might help the two of you sort out what's going on & why she's always so antsy to get back to him when she's only just gotten home.

[racer812]

It's not me. I have only sent an email that was never answered. Except for the email I have had no contact with H.
And as far as our agreement goes, K has not spent any alone time with H this trip. Unless she is breaking our agreement and is doing it in secret:(.
I was pretty sure that my gesture would be taken the way it was, I know this woman very well;).
K has one more nite before she and the kids head for home and she is going to some close friends of ours for a bbq and to spend the nite. If she has any plans to spend time with H, as in intimately, she is suppose to call and "check in", make sure I'm ok with it. I dont think she will bring him around our friends, they dont know about our lifestyle(is poly a lifestyle?).
Also called attention to K's F.B. profile, where she put her relationship as complicated, interesting conversation. Will have to wait and see if it gets changed.
Thanks again gang. All of your words help.

[AutumnalTone]

K must make her choice, whether its good or bad for me!

To provide another view:

When are you going to take responsibility for yourself?

If you want your life to improve, you *and only you* are responsible for your involvements. If those aren't working, you're responsible for changing things so they work. Putting the onus on others to decide what your involvements are and whether they're good or bad can be described (most charitably) as irresponsible.

[racer812]

Hhhmmm.........interesting point of view. I don't know, I have always been a "giver", always put everyone else before me. My whole family has always come before me. I didn't realize that I do that. It's just natural for me to do that. I read Autumnal Tones post yesterday (monday) and thought about it till today(tuesday). I even put K's happiness (still) before mine, is that unhealthy?:confused:

[Breathesgirl]

Putting others ahead of yourself can be healthy in moderate amounts but when you rarely or never do things for your own happiness it is very unhealthy.

It sounds like you need another one of your hiking camping trips to sort things out.

[MonoVCPHG]

I even put K's happiness (still) before mine, is that unhealthy?:confused:

I am a pretty heavy giver to those I care about. I live most of my life putting others ahead of myself and have been rewarded nicely. I am lucky because the people I surround myself with are more balanced givers and takers. The problem occurs when a heavy "giver" becomes involved with a heavy "taker". Then the imbalance can result in a lot of manipulation and one sided rewards.

[racer812]

K is (was) a heavy giver but something has changed. She is now selfish. It has become all about her. And because of that and everything else that has happened in the last few months we are going to separate, possibly for good.
She told me last night that she is not happy here and is unsure if she is unhappy with me or the situation. Her head is swimming she says. Then turns around and says she wants to be friends. :confused:
Tonite when we talk I'm gonna suggest that she move to nv where she wants to be. Take time for herself and figure out if I am to be part of her life or if we are truly done.
I feel so drained, emotionally and physically. I asked her if I should move to the extra bedroom, her answer was no. I told her that sharing a bed with her is torture, because all I want to do is touch her, hold her, kiss her,thats part of what we do (did) in bed together, snuggle. Her response to this was , you can still do that, I still want you to. Huh!?!
A close lady friend knows whats going on and told me that she did the same thing to her ex. Wanted to keep her options open was her excuse.
So, thats my last 2 days in a nutshell. I am preparing myself as best as possible to walk away from the love of my life. Perhaps it will be the best thing for us. I hope that she finds what she is looking for. I really do.

[racer812]

I received a phone call for a job interview, its with a company that I have been trying to get on with for over a year. A friend who works for the company told me that just getting an interview is a HUGE step.
When I told K, she was very excited for me. But it still doesn't help my situation. She still wants to move. I asked her if she could wait for about 1 year then I could transfer. She doesn't think she can wait.
I told her about my idea for her to move and get settled and get her mind together. She is now thinking about it. When(positive thoughts) I start this new job I will be stuck here in essence, unable to move(unwilling??) or transfer for at least 1 year, probably more.
Talking with K this morning only serves to confuse and hurt me more. I can fell myself shutting down, building walls to protect myself from more pain, I dont understand how in one sentence she says she needs time and in the next say she still wants to be intimate with me. Part of me wants nothing more than to throw her on the bed and ravage her body with love. The other part wants to stay away and avoid the pain of losing her. Part of me is ready to give up. Why try so hard to show her my love and try so hard to accept what she has with H if I'm just gonna end up alone?
My heart tells me she has made up her mind. Then why not just tell me the answer? Is she trying to protect my feelings? Why bother when my heart is already broken. No offense to any ladies here or anywhere else, but why can't you just say what you want? Why must everything be so complicated when it comes to women telling their feelings and what they want?

WOW! that was kinda long! I do feel better getting it off my chest. thanks for reading and any advice or insight.

[FormerUnicorn]

Congratulations on the interview. I hope that you get the job you are seeking.

As for your wife's waffling and your comment about women and what they want, it sort of sounds like to me your wife may have been living with some repressed wants and needs that she's in the middle of acknowledging and sorting out. She may not know what she wants right now, or she does, but she sees them as conflicting, or even that what she wants changes from moment to moment. It sounds like this is something she really needs to do in order to be happy.

None of this in any way excuses her behavior to you, and I think that I'm going to add my two cents in to the growing pile of coins that suggest that you need to make sure that you're doing all you can to protect yourself and make sure that you're looking out for yourself and your children.

If you want an interesting take on gender differences in communication, I suggest the often laughable but still insightful "Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus" book. You might discover some behavior patterns that you find familiar and some new ways to think about them that may give you some confidence in yourself and in your communication with your wife.

Good luck.

[racer812]

I actually read that book years and years ago. I thought it had some pretty good info on how the sexes communicate differently. I think alot of her indecisiveness comes from the fact that she reconnected with her ex and didn't bank on all of the old feelings still being there, or she did and thought that she, and I, could handle it. Dont know. As for protecting myself.......well.......
Now the kids is a whole different story. They are not happy here either and would love to move, they dont know that I might not be going. We will have to address that issue when it comes up.
I told K that she needs to come to a decision, I understand that it will take some time, so that we can make the necessary plans to make sure that everyone is taken care of. She also told me all she wants to do is run. Away from here, me, everything. I have been patient and try to be supportive in helping her figure this out. I really think she has the grass is greener syndrome. Is the grass greener? I really dont know. My first answer would be, of course, no, not at all, I have the greenest grass, my grass is the best! But as we all know beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I know we have said and done alot of things over the course of this whole roller coaster, but I dont hate her. I might be hurt, angry, upset but I could never hate her.

[FormerUnicorn]

As for protecting myself.......well.......

Now the kids is a whole different story.

Since you're more concerned about your children than about yourself, let me put things in another light. What sort of lessons do you want your kids to take away from all of this? No matter how hard you try to shelter them, they will pick up on the fact that something is wrong. Do you want them to have memories of a father who was self-sacrificing and unhappy? What sort of example does that set about self-worth and happiness? About boundaries, and healthy relationships?

I'm going to echo the sentiments said many times on this site and elsewhere:

It's better to be truthful with your kids, because they are more perceptive than people give them credit for, and if you don't tell them what is wrong, they will invent stories that are far worse. Without your responsible input to set them straight, they will internalize it more, and you don't want them to feel it is their fault.

There are ways to tell them what the problem is without disclosing things that are inappropriate for children. Don't feel like you have to explain every detail, because that's not what they need.

Whatever conclusions you and your wife come to will ultimately be for the best, but only if you make sure you are doing right by yourself as well.

[racer812]

K hasn't decided to leave yet.
I know my kids are very perceptive. I think alot of K's decision will be based on whether or not I land this new job. Then again she might be planning to go sooner. I gave her the option of moving and getting herself settled. Wait for the kids to finish this school year and then go from there.
I honestly have no idea what she wants and really think that she doesnt know what she wants either.
I am making the necessary plans to ensure that my kids will be taken care of, I think alot of their reaction will be based on how we present the situation. If we do it in a positive way then the stress of our situation will be small and should not effect them in a bad way.
I remember when my parents divorced. My mother was very mean and hateful to my father, made it very hard for my sister and I. My parents were at a point that they didnt like each other and we knew it. K and I are not at that point and I dont think it will get to that point. She is my best friend, we can and do talk about everything. Her being happy means alot to me. Even if it means being apart. My happiness comes from my kids and how I will live my life.

[racer812]

Well, had a great weekend with K and the kids. I have decided that I am going to enjoy what time I have with K. Make the most of what we have. There still is hope, she's not running into H's arms. It will be a little bit of time before she moves. I have to get my benefits started on the new job(thinkin positive) to cover the kids and then she will move. Then again (positive thinkin) she might stay, but I doubt it. She wants to move really bad.
I think she is thinking that moving back will solve her problems. But it won't. Never does. Perhaps we have come to a point in our lives that we(she??) need to part ways and live our lives separately. Perhaps some time apart will bring things back in perspective. I don't know the answers and I can't live in the past. So I look forward to my future and living my life to the fullest.

[racer812]

Today I received the call that I have been waiting for. I start my new job on the 30th of this month. I'm so excited!:D. My life seems to be turning around, at least on the professional level. Now if I can get it to turn around on the personal level.
K had a phone interview today, with an employer in NV:(. So I'm not sure where that leaves me. I can't leave this new job, I've worked to hard to get it. We are still friends and seem to be getting along great. Talking and spending time as a family. Feels to good to be true.

I just wish I knew what she is gonna do. Makes it hard for me to not wall her out, to keep from being hurt more. She still wants to be intimate and have everything like it was. Perhaps she just wants to keep me as an option. Its getting old with the waiting game. I'm pretty sure that she is still moving. Maybe she wants to keep me interested in case things don't go well with H. Maybe all I will be is her booty call.

[FormerUnicorn]

Congratulations on your job. I'm very glad to hear the news.

[racer812]

The new job is gonna be great! Everything about it is a step up!:D

Now the bad:(. K is becoming more and more distant every day. I had a great weekend with K and the little ones. But I can feel her pulling away from me. I thought I had prepared myself better for this but it still hurts.

So I'm trying to stay focused on my new career and enjoy the time that I have with my little ones. And try as I might, I feel the walls building inside(ugh!) to try and protect myself from the heartache that is coming,roaring in my head like an avalanche. I dont want to wall her out. Oops! Sorry, dwelling on the negative, not doing that!

Anyways, I will keep writing on my blog and keep you all as informed as possible. thanks for reading and any replies or insite.

[MonoVCPHG]

Thanks to you my friend. It's people like you who share and make themselves vulnerable that provide the life and learning to this forum. If people just wanted regurgitated theory, they could go anywhere. Thanks again, you're a huge contributor to this community :)

[racer812]

Thank you for the kind words Mono. I find that it really helps me keep things in perspective when i can write them down and look back at it.
So, now on to the good. Had to go to the new job today for orientation and the obligatory screening. Got sized for my new uniforms and begin training at the end of this month. Finished the background process and the physical. WOW! Lots of stuff to prepare for.
The bad. K's whole demeanor has changed towards me. Now, when we talk on the phone, its short and to the point. We used to just call each other to see how the others day was going and she would always finish with "I love you". Now she doesn't say it until I do, and it sounds more like an auto reflex, like the " hi, how are you today?" thing. I'm pretty sure that K is just waiting for my new job to take off and the benefits to kick in before she leaves. She still is keeping things from me and everything is fine as long as I don't bring up anything to do with H.
The ugly. Text with the high school sweety today. It started out good then went down hill very quickly. Basically she wants to know why we split up all those years ago and if I ever loved her. UGH! I tried to explain my feelings and what she meant to me. I dont think she liked my answers, she stopped texting and wont answer when I call. I feel bad that I hurt her feelings, but I was being truthful. Guess thats not always the best way to be.

So, thats my life up til today.

[racer812]

Had a long talk with K last night, while laying in bed. We talked about her leaving and the reason why she is doing it.
I don't understand the reason why, she says she is going to leave so that I can be happy. Huh???? That totally blows my mind! K says she is going to stay here with me until I get my new job and benefits rolling so that I will have some stability. I am so lost and confused and hurt! How can she tell me that she loves me and wants me to be happy and wants to make love to me and then keep planning to leave? Why drag this out? Why prolong the pain?
K says that her leaving has nothing to do with H, but I think that she is just trying to keep from hurting me. But I'm already hurt! Part of me wants to build the walls to protect my feelings, the other part doesn't want to let her go. On one hand I want to tell her to leave, so the hurt will stop. On the other i dont want to lose what makes me happy.
Any ideas or advice, incite,answers would be greatly appreciated. thank you all.

[TL4everu2]

Ahhh...The "walls"....I hate the walls, but I, too, have had to replace those walls that I had up once before. I feel your pain Racer....I really do. It just sucks. No matter what you say or do...It just isn't right. Sigh....Sorry to hear all this Racer. I hope you can make it work.

[racer812]

I want nothing more than to make it work. But if only one of us is willing.......
K has,in my opinion, already made up her mind on what she is going to do. I think alot of what she has done has been to ease her guilt. She is trying to make me be the bad guy and I wont play that game. So she changed her tactics and now wants to make sure that I will be OK. She is being very secretive and is hiding the fact that she is looking for work in NV. She even went as far to tell me that she thought about moving close to her uncle. I think that she is just telling me that to ease my pain.
When we were talking the other night, K was saying that she thinks we need time apart and she always has the option of coming back. I had to bite my tongue because I wanted to say, so badly, "are you sure?". But I didn't and I'm not sure why. I hate the fact that I'm walling her out! But I'm to the point that no matter what I say or what I do its just not enough, so why try to keep someone that doesn't want me?
It still hurts that someone I love so much, wants nothing to do with me. I guess being friends is better than nothing. I don't know.
Well thanks for reading.

[TL4everu2]

It still hurts that someone I love so much, wants nothing to do with me. I guess being friends is better than nothing. I don't know.
Well thanks for reading.I know, and feel, your pain here. Sorry to hear all this Racer....REALLY sorry to hear it.:(

[FormerUnicorn]

Aw, man, this just sounds terrible. I really feel for you.

[racer812]

Now I'm really confused! It's Sunday morning and I'm awake after having an amazing night with K. We bbq'ed(pretty much the norm for us), had a really taste dinner, sat out on the back patio, had a few drinks and watched the rain. K then proceeded to seduce me and......Well the rest was just wonderful!
So I sit here with my cup of coffee and the laptop wondering what the deal is. I mean is she leaving, is she staying? :confused:!
I guess I need to look at the positive side, she still wants to be intimate with me. I think I'm just gonna enjoy the time that I have with K and deal with the negative as it comes.
I still have some questions but I think I will just wait and see. I will focus on the positives in my life, my new career, my kids, get ready to start riding again, maybe even do a couple of races this year. Think positive, release the negative!

[racer812]

So my last monday at my current job could have been better, but I dont expect much from that company, one of the reasons I'm leavin. Picked up my replacement phone since I broke the screen on mine last week. Also took K's phone in for an update. Kinda surprised that she let me take it!
Really blew her and H's minds this afternoon, sent a friend request on facebook to H. Now their minds are goin like crazy tryin to figure out what I'm up to. Just my little way of getting some mind games goin for them.;)
I have decided that its only a matter of time until K leaves. Even if she stays, it wont be to be with me. If she stays here with me I feel it would all be a lie. She is not happy here and shes not happy with me. I cant live with myself knowing that she stayed for something other than love. Shit! I just lost my train of thought! I hate when that happens! Well, I guess the rest just isn't that important! Until next time, peace out!:D

[TL4everu2]

My wife and I call that "falling off the thought train". LOL It sounds like you're getting over this whole ordeal. Good for you. ;)

[racer812]

Thats funny! I gotta try to remember that!
Just another day in paradise for me. Not much happening, just alot of unanswered questions. I am to the point now that i just want K to leave. I know, sounds terrible, but I'm tired of the not knowing and the behind the back shit. Also, lol, never did get a response from H on the FB friendship thing. I figured him for a coward anyways. He left K 21 years ago and I think he'll do it again. Sucks for her! K thinks that if(when) she leaves she can always come home to me. At this moment my answer would be NO!
I actually text with my high school sweetie today, we are starting slow and meeting each other again. Its been along time since we have been around each other and alot has changed. So we will be friends first and see if it goes beyond. Not sure I want it to go past the friendship stage, she's still married, and I dont want to cause any problems or influence anybody in a negative way.
I'm just gonna focus on my new career and my kids for now. Try to make this as easy for them as possible.

[DharmaBum23]

Thats funny! I gotta try to remember that!
Just another day in paradise for me. Not much happening, just alot of unanswered questions. I am to the point now that i just want K to leave. I know, sounds terrible, but I'm tired of the not knowing and the behind the back shit.


No, that's not odd at all.

What you've been going through looks like something I call "death by a thousand hesitation cuts".

You know K is going to leave. K knows K is going to leave. No matter how nice she is to you, you both know she is going to be leaving.

After awhile it is more merciful to just end it.

[racer812]

I totally agree! Why not just end it? My answer is.......I can't. I know she is unhappy and I accept that she will leave, but I won't be the reason. If I tell K to get out or leave or what ever, that will be her excuse to use. If she leaves I want it to be by her choice, not me being "the bad guy" and easing her guilt. She is carrying alot of guilt because she has no real reason for leaving me, so if I become the bad guy, I'm her reason. Sorry! Not gonna happen! I'm not the bad guy here. I will admit that the problem is ours and not hers alone. I will admit that I have tried to make it better for her, even trying to accept an ex bf that was forced down my throat. I also will admit that I sometimes have a hard time getting my meaning across like I want. I just want people who read this to know that, it takes two. Two people to make or break a relationship. Everybody that reads this is only seeing half the story. I have suggested to K that she get on this forum because of the great people and wealth of knowledge. Still dont thing she has even logged on once, her lose.

[Ariakas]

I totally agree! Why not just end it? My answer is.......I can't. I know she is unhappy and I accept that she will leave, but I won't be the reason. If I tell K to get out or leave or what ever, that will be her excuse to use. .

So you would rather both of you be miserable together? You could always "man up" and do the right thing. You see the writing on the wall, no reason you can't get it done with and stop all of this

Two people to make or break a relationship

Thats correct but missing the third part...

Two people to make or break a relationship, and only one to end it...

Do yourself a favour end it, and start healing. Instead of protecting your own honour it sounds more like you are dependent on the existing situation regardless of how bad.

[Jade]

I respectfully suggest that you are making this decision based on pride, not self-preservation. Why are you ceding your life to this, when you know the relationship will not last? How does the decision to not be "the bad guy" serve her? More importantly, how does it serve you?

[racer812]

I am totally co dependent. I have been with this woman for almost 20 years! Maybe thats our problem, we are both co dependent. I also want to state that K is the one choosing to end what we have, not me. I would much rather repair what is damaged, go to counseling, hell, I'm even willing to go to church if that would fix the problem. But she doesn't want to do any of that. I'm just a friend with benefits to her. I'm just the one she settled for when H left her standing there and ran away from his problems. I have never ran away from K and I never will. I wont run away from the problem, never have, I prefer to face my problems and resolve them. Thats just me though and I realize that not everybody is like me. I guess I should just get the inevitable over with, start the rebuilding. I think its time to talk to K tonite.

[Ariakas]

I am totally co dependent. I have been with this woman for almost 20 years! Maybe thats our problem, we are both co dependent. I also want to state that K is the one choosing to end what we have, not me.

Ok...then maybe you need to start figuring out how not to be? Co dependency is a massive amount of strain on a relationship. Once step to possibly repairing, since you are deadset against anything else, is to stop the dependency.

do you have things outside of the relationship? Friends, hobbies...things to do that are not part of being a married couple? Not part of the stress...

Couples counselling would help with this I would think. But you could seek counselling on your own to stop the unhealthy habit of co-dependency :)

Good luck

[racer812]

Well, had a nice weekend. Had a nice long talk with K. She is gonna stay with me until the benefits kick in on my new career. Meanwhile she is looking for work in NV. I have suggested counselling, but K isn't willing. She keeps telling me the reason she is leaving has nothing to do with H. Somehow I dont believe it.

Started orientation and training today. 7 weeks! I dont think I have ever had so much training. But thats part of the new career.

[MonoVCPHG]

Well, had a nice weekend. Had a nice long talk with K. She is gonna stay with me until the benefits kick in on my new career. Meanwhile she is looking for work in NV. I have suggested counselling, but K isn't willing. She keeps telling me the reason she is leaving has nothing to do with H. Somehow I dont believe it.

Started orientation and training today. 7 weeks! I dont think I have ever had so much training. But thats part of the new career.


Focus on that new career my friend! You've tried your best with K. Now think of the future and what might be instead of what was.

No matter what, it would be great if you stayed in touch with us :)

Take care
Mono

[racer812]

Even if I have to buy my own laptop, I will still post on this forum. Some how I have a bond with all who have posted on this blog.
I am focusing on my new career, lots to learn and remember. I am looking to the future. I am planning what I am going to do. I think I have an excellent opportunity with this company. My attitude and my limitations are all that can hold me back on advancement. I even have the ability to transfer. If I choose.

I think I ruffled K's feathers last night. Going thru all of the paperwork for my benefits and getting insurance setup. When K asked me about direct deposit to our joint account, I told her that I will open my own account. She didnt like that! What the hell? Did she think I was gonna give her free access to my money? Come on! How dumb does she think I am? I will go with my first paycheck and open my own account and remove myself from our joint account. I feel that it is the best thing to do, that way we are both protected.

[MonoVCPHG]

I think I ruffled K's feathers last night. Going thru all of the paperwork for my benefits and getting insurance setup. When K asked me about direct deposit to our joint account, I told her that I will open my own account. She didnt like that! What the hell? Did she think I was gonna give her free access to my money? Come on! How dumb does she think I am? I will go with my first paycheck and open my own account and remove myself from our joint account. I feel that it is the best thing to do, that way we are both protected.

I'm glad you will stick around and also that you are looking after yourself. You're not doing anything wrong so be strong and stay focussed on your future :)

[Jade]

Proud of you, Racer. You're strong!

[FormerUnicorn]

Well gee, what did she expect! I have a feeling this separation is going to be quite different than what she imagines.

Go you! I'm so glad to hear that you're excited about your new job!

[racer812]

I have to be! If I stay focused on the negative, I will go crazy! So i focus on my new career and my kids. We just finished a talk and I think the kids are going to stay with me. That is exactly what I would like. So when my training is finished I will request a shift that allows me the time that my kids will need me. K says she is going to live with her friend, but I know what she is planning. It makes me angry that she still wont be honest with me. But thats her choice and her loss. I am slowly moving our things apart, financial mostly. Getting my ducks in a row so to speak. Thank you all for the positive comments, they help.

[racer812]

Wow!! What a week. I only have 5 more weeks until I'm done with training. Lucky for me its getting better. Not so much death by power point! More hands on! I like that.
Personal life is still complicated. I want so badly to be the mean guy, kick K out on her ass, but I just can't lower myself to her level. I still love her, always will.
Eventually I will be able to move on and I hope I can find happiness. I know it will take time and I'm in no big hurry. Thanks for reading and any posts.

[racer812]

Had a very interesting conversation with one of my lady friends today. I will call her S, makes things easier to keep track of.
S and I have known each other for a really long time. I have always liked her and I will not lie I am attracted to her. It just so happened that we were/are both in relationships, so I never acted on my feelings towards her. Through my entire ordeal with K, S has been my rock. S has been the person that I have shared everything with, her incite has been so helpful. S has been in a relationship for about 4 1/2 years now. I received a call from S on friday nite, she said she needed to talk. So we talked, for a long time. S's current relationship is coming to an end, I feel for her. So to bring us to today, I swing by and check on S. Her soon to be ex is gone and her and I had a really nice talk. I now have a "date" with her. This is mostly for us to just get away from our pressures at home. Unwind a little. I am trying not to get my hopes up, but its hard to not get excited to maybe take this to the next step. Part of me wants to start the ground work for more. Part of me wants to stay back and remain friends. Tough decision. I think, after we get our home lives straightened out, I will talk with her and see if she has the same feelings. See if S might want to go to the next level, so to speak.
It makes me feel good to be around her, she is so honest. I know she will tell me what she feels, no lies, no half truths. Nice change of pace.

[racer812]

My roller coaster is at full speed! I have not held anything back from K. If she asks a question, I tell her my answer. Its that simple. K, on the other hand, is still playing her games, well, at least she is trying. I have come to the realization that she is leaving. There is nothing that I can do, say, or change to keep her. Ok. It hurts but its the truth. Had a long discussion about false hopes, all on my part. I was hoping that I could make her happy and she would stay. K would give me the impression that it was possible. Well, after catching her in another lie, I have decided that I will move on. So I have been talking to my friend, S, about all that has gone on in my life. Now S is having serious issues in her relationship. K has asked me about S and her options for changing her situation. K knows that I have a "thing" for S. Now all of the sudden, K is very jealous! I have not acted on my feelings for S, ever! Now that K realizes that I will move on and have "options" so to speak, she is changing her plans. K and I had another discussion and K throws the idea out that S could come and stay with us! What the! First K gets jealous. Then she wants S to move in? Am I that dumb? Does K honestly think that I dont see this trap? Just makes me wonder.
So there you go, another look into my crazy life.

[racer812]

WOW!! What happens in 3 days can change your life! Now outta the blue, K tells me she is staying:confused:. Now I'm so conflicted on what to do:(. I am/was ready to move on with my life and now K changes her mind. I asked for the reason why she changed her mind, and all I get is the same old crap about the kids and she doesn't want to lose what she has. What the hell?!
I know that something happened between her and H. But I can't get any answers. I am so afraid that this is just temporary. I feel that K has settled for me again when she can't get who she wants. I'm not even sure what I should do. Part of me wants to have her be a part of my life. The other part of me, the part that I probably should be listening to, is saying be cautious and get out! We went out last night, and just spent sometime together. It was nice. But in the back of my mind I think I should move on. Something doesn't feel right. I think I will plan on moving out. Give it sometime and see if K really wants to be with me. Time apart might just be what we need.
Thanks for reading.

[TL4everu2]

Racer, I think that would be wise. This way, she can see if YOU are really what she wants. Sadly, she is still trying to see how much YOU want her. Anyway, good luck.

[racer812]

Well if K is trying to see how much I want her, she might just be surprised. Unless I bring up the subject, she acts like everything is normal. I don't trust her anymore, I don't believe anything she tells me. How the hell can you have a relationship if you dont have those 2 things? If we are going to rebuild, then things have to change. I think I am going to tell K that she must choose, perhaps she already has. But is this a permanent thing or just for now? These are all questions that I have and, I feel, that don't get answered honestly. I have caught her in so many lies that its very difficult to trust anything she tells me. K was suppose to go to Nevada for job interviews and to spend the weekend with H, I found this out by reading her text messages again, when I asked her about it she denied having any plans like that! Its very frustrating to have the answers in front of you and then someone that you are suppose to love and respect and trust, tell you something entirely different. On top of that, my friend S is going to stay with her guy and he is now calling me and playing the whole jealous BF bit. So now its hard to be able to talk to her about whats going on with my life.
Wow! I just read back thru my post and I kinda rambled. Sorry if it doesn't make much sense. I am just trying to get this stuff off my chest. Thanks for reading.

[polyexplorer]

If there is little trust in the relationship, how can one connect at a deep level? I can totally understand why you are feeling that things are not quite right when the trust isn't there. Sounds normal to me...

[racer812]

I have stated that I do not trust her. And now that trust is totally gone. Caught K in another lie! I guess I need to speed up this separation process. I have also found out that K is looking for and apartment in another town, go figure. My gut told me something was up. So I'm not real sure how to proceed. I have never had to do this with someone that I care so much about. This feeling that I have totally sucks!
K took the family on a mini vacation, it was really nice. She showered me with attention and affection. But I have the feeling that its not real, something tells me its all just a show, all fake. I won't ignore my gut feeling anymore. Right now I'm just trying to get my thoughts in order and figure out how to proceed. This might take some time. I have to focus on the positives in my life.

[SNeacail]

This is sad and my heart goes out to you. Talk with an attorney to see what you need to do/not do to protect yourself and your kids.

[FormerUnicorn]

Racer, I really feel for you and I'm very proud that you've gotten to the point where you're willing to protect yourself. I'm sorry the situation sucks, but I think you are being very wise about the whole matter.

[racer812]

Wise?!?! Me, wise!?!? I never have looked at myself as being wise. But the more time that passes and the more I look at whats wrong with our relationship, the less options I see. I continually catch K in lies! Could marriage counseling help this? Maybe K needs to see a shrink(psychiatrist)? I'm to the point now that I'm ready for her to leave!
K asked me to forgive her. I have a very difficult time in forgiving anybody that has wronged me. Especially when that person continues to do it! I really think that K doesn't see what she has done as bad, or destructive to us. I have become detached from her, built up my wall to protect me.I'm not even sure I want her to stay in my life anymore! She went from bound and determined to leave to I'm gonna stay now. All this changed in a week! UGH!! I hate this feeling of not trusting someone and wondering if what they are telling you is true or not. Makes life way more stressful than it should be.

[TL4everu2]

Racer,
I am going to offer up some strange advise. Talk with K. Show her where you have caught her lying to you. Point out that, while you WANT to trust her, you have a VERY hard time doing so.

You said that you loved her.....Give her an honest chance to fix what she has broken. It will take time...LOTS of time. But it very well could be worth it.

One of the stipulations needs to be that she cut off all communication with her beau. If she is unwilling to do so, then she is not truely committed to YOU. I would cut off anyone who came between me and my wife. (I HAVE done this in fact) and I know she would do the same for me. It is a small price to pay, to remain with someone you claim to love so much. ;) Just an opinion.

[racer812]

TL, that is not strange advice! What you wrote, makes perfect sense to me. We have some down time this weekend, and I think its a perfect time to try to talk with her. Thank you! I think that it is truly sound advice.

[TL4everu2]

Well, Racer, I REALLY love to see peoples relationships work out. I hate to watch, what was once a wonderful union, turn to mush and disolve. It is so sad when that happens. So I try to make sure I help to put them back together if it's possible. MOST of the time, the two are splitting because of a lack of communication, a MIS-communication, or a lack of compromise.

When L and I dated our first couple, we watched as they slowly dissolved. It hurt US so bad, it almost turned us off from ever dating anyone else again. We tried to get them back together, but he had crossed the line. She caught him with another woman that she knew nothing about. They were swingers, and not really poly, so L and I were confused as to why she would have such a cow over it. L continued to date him, though. the female would have nothing to do with the rest of us because we were talking with and seeing him. :( Kinda sucked all around. Well, they eventually got a divorce, and the male of the couple, got married to the woman he "cheated" with. Apparently, it IS possible to cheat while swinging. Who knew? :rolleyes:

[racer812]

I have spent the last few days doing lots of thinking. I still think that K is planning something. As long as I dont bring up our issues everything is hunky dory. If I bring up the subject, instantly K gets defensive. I honestly take the time to think about what I am going to say before I say it. I think about how to say things to her so that she wont get defensive. Nothing seems to work. So as long as I keep quiet, its smooth sailing. I keep finding out about things that she is doing behind my back. I always thought that if you are in a serious relationship then there are no secrets. Apparently I am mistaken. Also K is extremely jealous now. She is checking my text messages and what ever else she can find. She is also watching and listening to everything that goes on between me and my friend, S. Basically she is doing everything she can to spy on me. Its funny how something as innocent as a friendship can be turned around and twisted. S and I have never acted on our feelings for each other. We have talked about them but we just never took that next step. Now K feels threatened. My life is an utter mess right now! Damn! Maybe I should take a break from all this. I am thinking that I should move out for a little bit. Still be there for K and especially my kids, but just get out and breath a little.

[TL4everu2]

Racer,
The advise I can give you is this: Don't do anything that you need to hide from K. Let her snoop and find the obvious which you have already proclaimed. Then, if she finds things, gently remind her that you have been open about those things the whole time anyway, so there was no secret. If you are finding her hiding things from her, then point them out to her and ask her about them. It COULD still be a simple misunderstanding. ;) Always think the best of someone until they prove differently to you. ;)

[racer812]

I dont think there is a misunderstanding, I could be wrong, but I have been honest with K thru this whole ordeal. I have told K, multiple times, that I dont trust her. I have told her that I want to rebuild our trust, rebuild our relationship. But every time I turn I find that she is still hiding things and she is still in contact with H. I think the only reason that she stayed with me is because of the kids and I am making good money. Again, I could be wrong. Any ways thats my mess I call life.

[racer812]

After going to bed last night, I laid there thinking( I have a hard time turning my brain off). I feel like all I am is a babysitter,maid,handyman,mechanic,paycheck, and occasional piece of ass! I have been putting everything into rebuilding our relationship, but I feel like I'm getting very little, if anything, in return. I am working on forgiving, forgetting is a whole other story, I am trying to let the past go.
I have never been one for forgiveness. When I am wronged or hurt, I tend to shut those people out of my life. I am trying very hard to not let that happen this time. I also don't have alot of patience. I tend to want things to happen now, not later. So now I must learn to forgive and have patience that things will work out for the better.

[Breathesgirl]

All I can say is ((((((((((((((racer812))))))))))))))) & lots more if you need 'em.

[TL4everu2]

When I am wronged or hurt, I tend to shut those people out of my life. I feel ya. I'm dealing with that kinda crap too right now. :mad: I don't blame you for feeling this way, but please try to be patient. I would really hate for it all to end this way for you. :(

[racer812]

Its been a very busy couple of weeks. My mood is a bit better. Now my K and my little ones are on their way to my home town for a Halloween party with some of my family. I am so paranoid that K has something planned that I am having my cousin keep his eye on her. Its small town, so if anything goes on, I will know.
What a terrible think to have to do. I wish I could trust her more. What a pathetic person I have become. I am so paranoid and worried that K is still planning things with H. Wow! I need to change or I need a change.

[TL4everu2]

So what will you do when you find out that she has done nothing?


Or that she has done something?

[SNeacail]

What a pathetic person I have become. I am so paranoid and worried that K is still planning things with H. Wow! I need to change or I need a change.

Not pathetic, smart and cautious. If nothing happens, she will have gained a little of your trust. If something does happen, you have a warning system that can protect yourself and your kids.

[racer812]

Haven't had time to post any updates, been so busy at work and gettin ready for a trip to the dunes. Cant wait to go!
The home life was going good, until we went out and K got a new tattoo. It doesn't bother me that she got some more work done, what bothers me is what she had put on her body. the new tat is of a chrysanthemum, it is the birth flower of November! And guess what! Thats the month that H was born! When I asked her about the flower she told me that its her grandmothers birth flower. Ok. Then when I asked her the next day she said that the flower was a carnation! And finally when I asked her the day after that she said its her grandmothers favorite flower! Am I that F ing stupid!?! So now, K says that I'm crazy and I am making stuff up in my head. Perhaps I am crazy. But when you have someone who you love and all they do is lie to you, would it make you crazy?
So now, K blames me for making stuff up and driving her away. I guess she expects me to sit quietly and let her do whatever she thinks up. The only saving grace is that her schedule and my schedule dont allow us to see each other. I'm still very hurt. I'm also not sure what to do.
Thanks for reading.

[racer812]

Update! Well had a good mini vacation. Just us and the little ones. Had some long talks with K, sitting at the campfire. I think we might have come to an understanding. K and I are basically going to start over. If that makes sense. We have finally come to an understanding. We are still a work in progress, but I think most people are that way. Its the only way we learn and evolve.
I have also made K jealous, not intentional, my H.S. sweety is goin thru a really tough time right now and called me to talk. I did not hide the fact that L called me and I told K what we talked about. It still made her jealous, so I made a point to spend some "alone time" with her.
So, heres to learning and growing as a human.

[TL4everu2]

Well, this is definatly good news to hear. Anything new on the tat?

[racer812]

K is stickin to her story about her new tatt. I find it to be to more than a coincidence. Her body, her choice. She's the one who has to live with it. I think she would absolutely flip if I got a tatt of someone else's birth sign on my body. I'm actually tryin not to think about it to much. If I dont dwell then I can stay focused on the present and stay positive.

[TL4everu2]

Sadly though, that is a bit self destructive. ;)

[MonoVCPHG]

Sadly though, that is a bit self destructive. ;)

I think you are right my friend.

[TL4everu2]

Ignoring a problem does not make it go away. Just sayin.

[racer812]

I know. Just not sure what else to do. K is stickin to her story. I am trying not to focus on the negatives. So I try and stay focused on the positives that I have in my life.

[racer812]

Its been a long, hard road. But I can see the end of this journey. A new journey is waiting for me. I dont think I will be posting on this thread any more. I really don't see a reason to. End of this journey, end of this thread.
I feel I have learned so much about myself and about people in my life.
Thank you to all who have read and given advice and incite. I will still be checking in every so often. I might even start a new blog.