Some Assembly Required

[Glitter]

Forewarning, this will be a long one ;)

This isn’t something I would normally share with the world. Blindly fumbling in the dark to find just a crack of light isn’t my normal forte. However, it’s not a bad story, nor an exceptional one at that.

I am T. I am a female. I am bi-curious but like dick more. Married to G, 99% straight male loves to cuddle and pamper. We met by chance, online, through chat. It was a whirlwind to say the least. After talking online and phone for a month, we met. We fell in love. We moved in together after just 4 months of knowing each other. That was 10 years ago.

7 years ago we married in a Wiccan/Pagan inspired ceremony. Nowhere in our vows did we commit to monogamy. I should have seen it, I wrote them myself, haha. Within a year I was suggesting we try adding another woman to our relationship, in order to spice things up and to have a full on loving relationship with this woman. At the time, we knew nothing of polyamory, nor of “Unicorn Hunters”. We feared backlash and excommunication from our families and friends.

Twice we attempted to assimilate a woman into our home, only to have it blow up in our faces. I felt so fucking jealous and hated G for wanting to love these other women. After about 6 months of this, we decided to halt our search and to focus on us. I shut down, emotionally and sexually, for years. Our relationship sagged and suffered. I neglected my husband and he resented me for it.

Fast forward to last year. I finally have the balls to suck it up and start facing my fears, my insecurities and found out why I felt the way I did. We end up moving to a house, outside of the city, in a small community that is so loving it’s unreal. My parents move into our house with us. This is hard, but we all eventually figure out how to have privacy and still share the house. G and I start having serious heart to heart talks about what we want in our relationship. I realize a few things.

1. I was not happy with the relationship. I want to explore something with a woman.
2. I want a family. A child or two of our own.
3. I want G to be happy and have a love that wants to be loved by him, and who can help relieve me (he’s extremely touchy-feely and sometimes it bothers me, as I was raised with food being the source of comfort, not physical attention).
4. G has VERY different taste in women than I do ;)

G and I talk about what kind of relationship we want to pursue. I suggest open relationship, but after discovering that is more about sex than a relationship, we agree that is not for us. We are not interested in swinging. We start looking online for clues as to what we want. We discover this forum, and finally start to understand what we are.

After a long time of talking about it constantly, we begin to understand that we want separate relationships. I don’t want to have a Triad, I want someone else, apart from our relationship, to love. He wants someone else, apart from our relationship, to love. We start on OKC and I immediately discover that most of the women interested in me, are not accepting of a poly relationship. Many inform me that I am a sick and twisted pervert for it. Oh well. I discuss with G, the idea of opening up to looking for both men and women. G is fine with it, but is a bit nervous at the same time. Of course, I get a lot of “interest”, that is, until they discover that I am married and not willing to be a fuck buddy. Oh well (again). G gets depressed that no women are interested in him. He worries that he won’t find the right woman to share his life with. We continue to seek others and see what we find.

Flash forwards a bit, and (after disposing of a few septic potentials), a poly couple contacts me. I start talking with S, who is with P. He is interested in me; P is interested in G. Sounds good. We chat online many times, and skype in a group. We talk about what we want (polyfidelitous relationships), and what we don’t want (casual sex). We have a good time talking, and agree to meet.

S and P come to visit, and bring their son, whom we will call Bean. We have a lovely day, and decide to go to their home for the weekend. We are all operating as friends for now. Slow and steady wins the race, no?

The weekend goes well. We enjoy the company and the new part of the province we had yet to see (about an hour from home). We all feel comfortable with each other. Bean loves us, especially G. This floored me, as G is usually uncomfortable with children. This time he bonded with Bean and enjoyed playing with him. He later told me that P and S and Bean are a package deal. He wants to be with P, and Bean is always going to be a part of her life. I was shocked and very happy to hear (and witness!) this :D

P and S have their own issues. They are a bit rocky, but have admitted that they are still willing to see us, even if they broke up. It would be individually however, no group dates or anything like that. They don’t plan on breaking up however, and want to work through their issues. Good to hear.

We feel connected, all of us. We are taking this day by day, since we need to develop a decently solid foundation before we build the roof, haha. We talk about what we would like, in the future. Perhaps sharing a house, all 5 of us, in 2 or so years. We will see.

G is feeling big time NRE. He knows it ;) We talk about it, because he’s excited and wants P to be happy. S and I talk but are more realistic about things, I think. I feel a lot of new feelings for him. I care deeply for all three. We plan on having a few more dates, hopefully individually as well. See how things progress. Right now sex is off the table for everyone. We want to ease into this, not stumble and possibly shatter it. I think it is smart.

The biggest thing is how natural and wonderful it all felt. Knowing we can show affection, touch another intimately and look at another in “that way” without any anger, neither jealousy nor confusion. It’s just great to feel “normal” in our own unique way.

So, here we are. Talking online with each other. They are not out to anyone. G and I are out to my parents and possibly family (if they see our FB, they will know). G’s family knows nothing, and it will stay that way.

I do wonder a few things:
1. If we eventually cohabitate and start families together, how do we explain that to the extended family? I know we could say S donated to father a child for us, and G donated for them. However it seems rather convoluted to me. I know there is time to think about it, but I don’t want it to be something we never think about until it happens.
2. Private space – would be needed. I have pets, and S is allergic to them all. My home will never be pet-free, so they will need to be considered if and when the time comes.
3. Perhaps 2 homes would be better, but next door to each other or something. All I have to go on is Big Love and Sister Wives :P
4. Will we lose more friends and/or family by coming out and cohabitating? What can we do to protect our rights and family from backlash (we are in Canada, less laws to worry about, but I am no lawyer)?

G and I have a much better relationship now. We openly show affection, I do not take him for granted, and he feels loved by me. Being open about who we are and what we want has seriously helped our relationship. Before this, I could easily see us decaying into some stinking goop that no one would want to touch.

So, this is my story-in-the-making. I hope G will join in on this discussion, if he chooses. I will invite S and P to as well, however not sure if they will want to.

Here we are, some assembly required.

[LovingRadiance]

I LOVE your title!

[SNeacail]

I do wonder a few things:
1. If we eventually cohabitate and start families together, how do we explain that to the extended family? I know we could say S donated to father a child for us, and G donated for them. However it seems rather convoluted to me. I know there is time to think about it, but I don’t want it to be something we never think about until it happens.
2. Private space – would be needed. I have pets, and S is allergic to them all. My home will never be pet-free, so they will need to be considered if and when the time comes.
3. Perhaps 2 homes would be better, but next door to each other or something. All I have to go on is Big Love and Sister Wives :P
4. Will we lose more friends and/or family by coming out and cohabitating? What can we do to protect our rights and family from backlash (we are in Canada, less laws to worry about, but I am no lawyer)?

1. Why explain things. "They live with us." If someone asks "Why?", just say "because that's the way the 4 of us like it" period, end of discussion. Yes, I live in a LARGE city where housing prices are mind boggling and multifamily co-habitation is basically normal.

2. You would have to get an extremely LARGE home to fit 4-6 adults (if your parents are still living with you) plus any more children that will come along. A duplex that could be converted to have a few shared areas, or even doorways between spaces. Keep the pets exclusively on your side.

For those that suffer with allergies, it can be extremely torturous to be around pets for more than a few hours at a time, sometimes just sitting in the same furniture the pets use is worse than the pet itself. It can also cause some life threatening side effects. For this reason alone, two houses likely on the same property would likely be a better solution. There are better allergy injections around nowadays, which can be helpful, but I would never even consider asking someone to live with a pet if they are severely allergic.

4. Can't say about the backlash of friends, but the way you approach things can make a difference in how they respond. Don't take a negative initial response as their final opinion on the issue. As far as the US vs Canada it depends on where you live in. Many states like California (and other West coast states) don't give a crap about your living situation beyond health and safety regulations (only so many people per # of bedrooms). From what I hear, some parts of Canada have some restrictive laws as well.

***SLOW DOWN!*** I realize you are trying to plan for the future, which is fun, but things are still new and over time, a lot of these things will just work them selves out. There are times when too much planning can set you up to be disappointed or cause anxiety in everyone and that can damage the relationship. Relax and let the relationships develop and unfold naturally for a while more.

[Glitter]

I LOVE your title!

Thank you!! :D It's something I was thinking about...how we are all "parts" of a relationship (regardless of with whom the relationship is, we are all individual parts of it). We just need to be assembled before we are completed. I don't know how many parts there are in total, but as long as we continue to add them in when the fit is right, we should be good ;)

1. Why explain things. "They live with us." If someone asks "Why?", just say "because that's the way the 4 of us like it" period, end of discussion. Yes, I live in a LARGE city where housing prices are mind boggling and multifamily co-habitation is basically normal.

True! My parents are planning on moving anyways, because they are wanting a place either further from town (rural) or more in town, not sure which to be honest. And that would allow for more trial visits, with some private space for them (if wanted). Of course, that is next year at a minimum, as everyone involved (parents want to move in the spring) needs to keep taking this slow.

Plus, this city is large enough that housing costs are redonkulous. It's one of the reasons my parents live here too. On our own, neither could afford this house. Cohabitation, regardless of with whom, just makes sense :) We're lucky that way!

2. You would have to get an extremely LARGE home to fit 4-6 adults (if your parents are still living with you) plus any more children that will come along. A duplex that could be converted to have a few shared areas, or even doorways between spaces. Keep the pets exclusively on your side.

For those that suffer with allergies, it can be extremely torturous to be around pets for more than a few hours at a time, sometimes just sitting in the same furniture the pets use is worse than the pet itself. It can also cause some life threatening side effects. For this reason alone, two houses likely on the same property would likely be a better solution. There are better allergy injections around nowadays, which can be helpful, but I would never even consider asking someone to live with a pet if they are severely allergic.

The allergies was something we were more worried about (though S spent an hour inside, with the animals, and he was ok, and there are allergy medications he can try). We use a hepa vacuum as well, and brush the furniture daily. Plus the cats/dogs have the option of going outside as they like, so they are not all squished into the house.


4. Can't say about the backlash of friends, but the way you approach things can make a difference in how they respond. Don't take a negative initial response as their final opinion on the issue. As far as the US vs Canada it depends on where you live in. Many states like California (and other West coast states) don't give a crap about your living situation beyond health and safety regulations (only so many people per # of bedrooms). From what I hear, some parts of Canada have some restrictive laws as well.

Thank you! We all will start to look at the laws and see what is expected/required by law (as per housing laws, I know there is nothing about living together, thankfully we don't have to worry about that).

***SLOW DOWN!*** I realize you are trying to plan for the future, which is fun, but things are still new and over time, a lot of these things will just work them selves out. There are times when too much planning can set you up to be disappointed or cause anxiety in everyone and that can damage the relationship. Relax and let the relationships develop and unfold naturally for a while more.

Very good points, thank you! And I agree, I need to just let go of some of those questions and worry about it once it plays out. I just don't want to dive head first into anything without understanding what the consequences of our actions would be. I've been reading many of the unhappy ending posts here, just so I can ream what I can from others' experiences. Basically I want everyone to have a good understanding of what can and may very well happen with us, before we get involved. And with a child already, I don't want to cause any heart ache for Bean. :cool:

[SNeacail]

The allergies was something we were more worried about (though S spent an hour inside, with the animals, and he was ok, and there are allergy medications he can try). We use a hepa vacuum as well, and brush the furniture daily. Plus the cats/dogs have the option of going outside as they like, so they are not all squished into the house.


My husband has severe pet allergies. He will be okay for a few hours to even a few days (if they vacuum daily) in a house with pets. However, by the second or third day, he is literally bed ridden with a migraine that will last for days after leaving the pets behind. His forehead an nose literally swell up to almost twice their size. I'm just the opposite, I will be bothered immediately, but once I get accustom to it, I start feeling better. So just as I feel better my husband is getting sick. Definitely something that can't be taken for granted.

Unless your Rosie from the Jetson's, it's almost impossible to keep up with the needed maintenance required to keep pets with someone with pet allergies, then again, it depends on the severity. Also remember the allergies are genetic, and the kids could be bothered as well (I have one that is and one that's not). The less fabrics (upholstery, carpet, drapes, etc) the better.

[Glitter]

Both of our homes are carpet free, thank goodness! I would like to get furniture that has less fabric so that it will be easier to clean. Right now a good sweeping daily, and vacuuming (along with using the slicker brush on the couch) daily has helped keep the allergens down. He told us he will know within the first 1/2 hour of being around animals if he will react, so I'm hoping with due diligence, that he will be fine. I don't expect him to be cuddling or petting the pets at all, and they are good at staying away from new people (especially the cats, we didn't see them for a long while the first day, lol!). Luckily Bean is so far not allergic to anything. I don't plan on adding any new pets (except for reptiles), and have been planning on rehoming a couple of the small pets due to my own lack of time for them. We will see ;)

[Glitter]

Entry #2:

G and I sat down and talked about what we want of this Quad relationship. We want a family unit, love shared and respect all around. We’ve asked S and P for a Skype chat so that we can all communicate what we all want and need.

S has told me he is very comfortable with daily communication, and prefers it. Wonderful for me, as I honestly did not realize how much I want to share with him, the goings on of my day-to-day life. Little, unimportant details that are old and usual with G and I, are new to S and P. I love it! I know, it’s NRE, but that is ok. We have distance between us, so we won’t be able to just burn out too quickly.

G told me he’s read this and he loved it. He said how much he appreciated reading it, from my point. He cares for P quite deeply and (according to S), she for him. So far everything seems to be working well ;)

I actually posted on Facebook, something about Poly. It’s rather blunt, and the only one, other than G, to say something is my biological dad. It’s interesting that he likes and appreciates the idea. I wonder how the rest of my family thinks?

S said he misses me. Major “Awwwwwwwwwwwwwwww!” moment :D Don’t get me wrong, I am not head over heels in love with him, but I do see it going that way if we all continue the way we are. I am a little scared of falling in love again. I love G with all my heart; it’s not our relationship I worry about. We’re solid, great foundation. I think I just want to go in without blinders on – just know what we want and what we don’t want.

And I miss them. I love my home and my pets and my daily life. But I miss hanging out with them. P wants to teach me some of her kitchen tricks (she is a chef), and I would love to do some cooking and baking for everyone. I think Bean would love playing with my niece, Doodle.

G and I watched a show on one of the movie channels last night, Polyamory: Married and Dating. I think that is the name. It’s a ½ hour show, but it was lovely. I was thrilled to see a working Triad and a working Quad. It was nice to see some dynamics, and to see honest emotions. No fluffy cotton candy goop glossing over the fact that people are human, and shit happens. We get jealous. We get annoyed. We get our feelings hurt and hearts broken. But we know this and still trudge forward through it to make our loves and us happy.

So enough for today, I don’t have too much to report ;) But all in all, I am enjoying this path we have chosen. It’s definitely not for everyone, but there is an amazing view ;)

Well, actually I need to NRE for just a moment ;) S has beautiful blue eyes with long dark lashes. G has stunning chocolate brown eyes with long luscious lashes. Damn, I am lucky ;)

[Glitter]

Entry #3

Sooo…S and P have broken up. I think. S claims he’s now a single man, but P isn’t saying much. G feels so bad for P, and wishes he could help her out some how. I’m on the fence with what I am feeling about S. I’ve noticed he blames her for all the problems, and never says that he has his own issues or faults. Big flags to both G and I. P admits her own faults, knows she isn’t perfect. I think I will back off a bit with S and see how things go.

Last night G and I spent a few hours talking about what we thought about S and P. We talked through the things we worried about (a huge desire to have children together and yet to keep G and I hidden from family and friends), and both didn’t know where that left us.

Tonight I decided that I don’t want to be a secret. I can handle privacy and all that, and not being open to everyone at the beginning. However, I don’t want to hiding in the poly closet forever, because someone has unreasonable expectations (wanting to be rich and famous before anyone finds out…realistically, how likely is that to happen?).

I think I surprised G by saying that if, in the future, he has a lover who wants to live with us in the home, I am open to that. He was shocked I would be so fine with it. I just told him, my limits are our bed is for us only. He shares her bed and not ours. He was very happy that I was open to it :D I am happy he’s happy ;)

So, I’m back updating my OKC profile. I’m chatting with a local fellow who seems pretty cool. G says he sounds like someone we’d both get along with (fellow laid back gamer type, lol). So I will see if he’s interested ;)

[Glitter]

Entry #4

I’ve decided that I am not going to pursue a relationship with S for now. He is blaming everyone and anyone for the break up of his relationship with P. He’s publicly bashing the world and her for this, and that is not sitting well with me. If he can’t hold his own baggage (thank you GalaGirl!), I don’t want to be with him.

I’ve encouraged P to talk whenever she wants or needs, to either of us. I tell G to give her a bit of space, but to tell her he is there if she ever wants or needs to talk.

I’ve been chatting with a local guy, whom I will call JB. He’s cool and likes many of the things we like. He said last night he’d love to hang out with me and/or go on a date. So, maybe ;) We’ll see. He has a more ‘friend’ vibe to me, which is fine as well.

Tried to have sexy time with G last night, only to be met with moodiness and a grumpy man. This morning was much better and has been lovey all day. I like that ;)

So, I am attempting to alter my OKC profile. I feel it’s too long and maybe too much info. If anyone wants to give me some help, let me know ;) I’ll send the link if wanted.

[Glitter]

I feel like a blubbery giggly goopy girl right now, but I am heading out on my first real date with S. I know, I said it was likely over, but he wants to make an effort, and I am willing to see how things go. Wish me luck! I am a nervous ball of girl right now :p

[Glitter]

Entry #6

I had a crazy amazing date with S. Not wickedly wild, but just great. We talked for hours, kissed and fondled a bit. Watched the shooting stars and talked more. We asked each other a lot of blunt, honest questions and each replied with honesty. I feel a real connection with him, and we both agreed to keep pursuing this relationship.

G had a pretty harsh evening. P told him she does not want a relationship with him, because of his stomach. She told him that if he works hard, loses weight; she might be willing to give him a chance in another year. Fat chance, pun intended. G saw her true light and realized how shallow she is. She spent the entire night bashing S and asking G if he knew what S and I were doing. They eventually quit chatting, and he was in a pissy mood (who wouldn’t be?).

I got home at nearly 5AM (5 hours later). G seemed to be in an angry mood (I assumed he was upset that this date may have been sexual). He told me all that P had said to him, how she kept giving him “threads of hope”, and just outright bashed S the entire time.

We had a very long discussion, as he did not want me to be around S (thinking P was talking absolute truth about him). I explained what we talked about, how he was, his emotional state and what we decided about our feelings for each other (definitely on the way to a full on loving relationship, just taking it slow so we don’t muck up our lives). It really opened G’s eyes that S can be a wonderful person, once he lets down the Bravado façade. He and G are very similar in their emotional needs and wants (and physical, haha). They have different interests (G is tech-inclined, S is artsy, like me).

But anyways, I decided to tell G what happened (he asked for details, S was fine with me telling G). G became so happy for me, and relished sharing my afterglow and NRE. We talked for a good 4 hours and cuddled. I still haven’t slept :p

But, G wants me to continue with S, as long as I feel it is something I want. He is so happy seeing me enjoying going out on dates, sharing common interests and just enjoying the new sexual energy and intimacy. He is in agreement that he wants to get to know S, the real S, without the Bravado. He wants to have a friend in his metamour. S wants this as well, calls us part of his family.

I honestly worried I would not be able to even hold his (S’s) hand. He was just as nervous as I was, lol. We laughed through our nerves and really opened up to each other. It was intimate but no sex. It was absolutely amazing. I’ve honestly had my sexuality bound up and gagged in a closet for so many years, it is liberating to share myself with someone whom I care for, and who cares for me. G and I have been together for 10 years, and we were very inexperienced when we met. It’s just different with S. I don’t compare them (apples and oranges, haha) I just love the differences.

G has slender fingers and smaller hands. He’s more submissive. He’s 2 years older than I. S has larger hands and thick fingers. I love the feel of them on the back of my neck! He’s very attentive, tender and…I don’t know how to describe it. He’s nothing like anyone I’ve ever been with. He is also 5 years younger than me. It’s rejuvenating.

Now, I don’t know what will happen between S and P. It doesn’t sound like they want to be with each other (based on conversations with both). I told S I will never give him advice or my opinions on his relationship with her. However I did tell him I would stand by him, whatever he decides to do. We also agreed to take whatever time we both need (more him at this point), and not label our relationship, but just date and not pursue anyone else. If we find anything lacking, or off or anything hinky, we will talk about it. It feels great having set our boundaries and set some goals (example, S and I will go camping within a month or so, for a few days alone). We have mutual agreements about not being intimate with anyone other than our partners and each other. Keep in contact and be honest about any needs we have (space, time alone, sexy time, cuddles, a shoulder to lean on, etc).

All in all, I am glad that I didn’t fully discard him. I had thought I should, briefly. I kept going back, and feeling I need to get him alone and talk. See who he is without P around. He’s a good soul, and I am grateful I went with my instinct to take it slow and go at his pace :)

I know there is some manipulation on P's part, promising sex if S stayed home instead of coming to see me - while for weeks has not allowed him to touch her (seen this in action myself). Then asking G to call S and find out what is happening, what we were doing, when he was coming home, etc. She said to both me and G, that she was fine if S and I had a relationship. Then says totally different things to G when we are not around. I think G and I will stay away from her...she sounds potentially toxic to me (am I wrong about this?).

[SNeacail]

p told him she does not want a relationship with him, because of his stomach. She told him that if he works hard, loses weight; she might be willing to give him a chance in another year.

run!!!

[Glitter]

run!!!

Thank you! G has already said she is out, because he is very strict with his personal rules, which include not being a doormat and not being manipulated by anyone, regardless of how attractive he finds them ;)

[Storm77]

Let me first say, having always been shy, scared to make first moves thinking I'll insult a woman. Having spent 3 days with S & P and never having the balls to ask P how she feels about me, how she'd think our overall relationship would work and encouraging by all T, S, P about just balls up, be honest and say what's on my mind when I approach women :p Tonight I DID ask P point blank if she found me attractive and if she thought we had any future. I DID tell her I want honesty as usual. I got the honesty and the truth. (even if it fucking sucks and I don't like it, lol)

Also thank you SNeacail. Yes that was an extremely harsh evening and overnight as I think I talked with P from about 11pm till 3am, trying to continually remember keep that "wall" up as it is now "just friends" as we just talked about things, some ways they would help eachother with their own relationship issues, etc. Which in itself is very complex, with before being "interested" in P or now being "rejected" by P puts me in a fairly bad light. But, I still DO want what is best for both of them and Bean and unfortunately even S agrees that it'll likely not be a happy ending.

I understand this is more about T and I, but rather than leaving that last bit wide open about the happy ending where readers are left to think WTF!? I think this should clear it up.

Basically S and P have been in a unstable relationship for years with resentment, anger, heated arguments and belittling eachother to just let off stream to prevent further fights. Neither is happy, one only stays in it blinded by love, accepting feeling worthless is worth the pain to keep the relationship going, both continue to live through the pain for Bean.

In spite of both saying they came from broken homes with anger and psychical fighting (just like this) they both want to keep it together for Bean. Now I may be wrong but common sense to me says raising a child only a few years old in that environment is not the best the the child since that is the main reason both choose to try to keep it together. I asked P ok you'll put up with it for Bean "for how long? Till Bean is 18? or longer?" Is not the best for Bean. I guess I've always been the counselor type while I CANNOT tell either of them oh just dump the other. I believe we both have been open trying to make them see reality outside of their anger and feelings they have. Looking at all the options and outcomes. Can it be fixed, whose willing to try and top of all how are each's own needs and feelings will be met so it can be a more equal open, honest relationship without feeling worthless and just putting ones feelings aside to make it work. Seeing their doctor, counseling, etc. Catching and trying to change the actions which lead so often lead to the bad feelings is also a very key part.

T didn't get home till around 5am when she was on cloud 9... *hangs head* till with my mind racing I was fairly angry preparing for the worst. I believe she stated earlier S like most men puts up a pretty thick macho tough guy attitude (which I hate in all men!!! In my opinon it makes them look fucking childish and I know *evil grin* that is just all the more insecure they are under it. I'm hoping S will get it just be yourself!!!) couple this with a locker room type way of joking S has *sighs* I really was worried if they both walked in and he cracked a joke something like "Man you're lucky, boy was T tight tonight!" I felt like I would have kicked the shit outa him and toss him out the door! :mad:

Now don't get me wrong, I'm perfectly fine and understand sex will happen. I want T to to be happy and of course part of their relationship will include sex. Admittedly I guess I'm a guy that even thinks it's hot in a kinky sort of way but the bottom line is Respect! in our/my house. Unless we were waaaaaaaay further down the road and casual about just screwing eachother at will while we're all at home. I told T while I could see us being that close and comfortable around eachother at some point if he's respectful. It would take quite a while before I might be ready for it.

In spite S saying P is just shy and P saying take it slow, it'll take time I never expected she would slam on the brakes over such an issue. Personally as intense as my love and feelings are (for potential or steady relationship), I was VERY surprised when P commented that she actually did not find me attractive due to having a bit of a belly (yes honestly currently 232lbs down from 250lbs about a month ago) I was not so much shocked or heartbroken but laughed and looked down and touched my stomach thinking wow on her part.

Now I'm not trying to deflect anger or be rude but the first thought I had was. S is likely in the high 200's closer to 300lbs but after a few seconds it was more clear in which I told her "well you know I understand, you've been with S for years! You're blindly in love with him as you've said, you probably don't even notice nor care how big he is as it's a long term relationship. Although with a secondary partner you DO have a choice, you CAN be picky. Your not stuck in the relationship yet as it's brand new and fresh."

After this we continued talking for hours just as friends. I think my biggest hurt was nothing really to do with P but my own feelings, insecurity and mind wandering thinking fuck now what! Plus the fact within five minutes this happening T was picked up for her date and started her very real relationship with S.

When T got home and after discussing why I was angry and that it was NOT about her time/date with S nor if they had sex or not. We had a very good night in spite of my harsh night with P. T and I ended up talking, enjoying the kinkiness of it and the NRE off T led to a very enjoyable night for us both. I admit we both did take a few jabs at P ;) as we talked and it just made things feel even more hot about S, knowing how good a night T and S had and while besides dumping me P stayed at home babysitting Bean asking "So how long do you think S & T will be out?" "Umm can you call S and ask when he'll be home?" Honestly I quickly said "sure np" and changed the subject but no way in hell I would phone and risk screwing up T's date (ya think!?) especially after the actions of P :p

While we had a great night once T got home the next day only after being up for a few hours it started weighing on me while I was back on Okcupid and several other dating sites.

Really nothing to do with P but the depressing thinking how "the couple" was a "perfect fit" emotionally, neither of us would feel left out. I loved the whole family dynamic feel, Bean brought out a side in me T has rarely if ever seen. Since I normally do not like children and try to get out of being around them. While we did not knowingly go out looking for swingers finding a M/F couple into us and claimed to both be looking for an actual ongoing relationship was just too bloody perfect! Now that family good feeling is gone. Instead will be replaced by two separate relationships. T & S and Myself & whoever.

Will it be better or worse I don't know. (fuck getting emotional even as I type this) As I said it weighed heavily on me last night, I was depressed, wanted to just cry, annoyed as fukin hell our pets would not bloody leave me alone! Went to lay down and got the dogs barking right outside my window. I was on the verge of exploding... Yes honestly even while on a bunch of crap to *rolls eyes* stabilize my mood. Pretty much begged T that I need to go out for a walk and talk with her now!!!

Told her my feelings, that I and in NO WAY angry at her, nor at S. How I realized the meds mostly dulled my feelings, anytime I did feel upset I had always managed to get her into talking kinky about it all or *cough* a more hands-on distraction. Said that I know they are MY feelings, I have to deal with them I just don't fukin now how right now!!! This was also the first time I admitted to T yes I feel selfish yes I really really wished things did not work out with S & P especially after P said it's over but S was already on his way here. Where I was thinking why why why, oh god if we could have just found another local couple, screw the one hour drive each time we wanted to see them. Also to have that family feeling and so no one feels left out. Had to say I'm sorry I feel like shit saying I wish it didn't work even tho I know how you care about S. It's just... it was so perfect with a couple!

I guess like getting a taste of something new and now is hands-down the best thing you've ever tasted! You believe nothing could beat that.

This also brought up my past thoughts. If should just shove my long time "good guy" lovey dovey sweet I so want to be in love with someone way of thinking and just instead adapt to finding a woman just for sex. Since with poly and swingers there seems to be tons more out there for "just sex" rather than those like myself looking for a loving honest relationship.

T says I shouldn't lower myself down to that level, be true to myself, she married the kind of person I currently am now. I honestly don't know, as we've explored this, I've been more open about sex and at times I do regret being the "nice guy" since my teenage years always needing the feeling of being in a relationship before sex!

Hmm to me it all boils down to what is logical, what are the odds, what will get me what I feel I need. T has changed, I'd say for the better since she's feeling sexually liberated.

I sit here confused, debating in my head. It's not about just sex... but maybe just sex would follow into a relationship. Can I stop feeling bad if I'm just one check-mark on a woman's to-do list for the week. Revolving more around just sex maybe I'd more likely find someone into fetishes I enjoy and that could be a relationship.

[nycindie]

I think you both are doing great in figuring out what you want and communicating your needs, etc., but you could do well to slow things down a bit. While it is great to know what you eventually want for yourselves, making plans for the future at such an early stage can set you up for deep disappointment. Don't hang all your hopes on S and P. Keep meeting people, see where the chemistry is, take chances but just a little bit at a time. Don't try to make a relationship out of a very new attraction before it really actually is one. Be patient, and keep learning from the process.

[Glitter]

Much agreed. I do keep meeting people, but there is no attraction. I mean, yes someone can be attractive or interesting, but there are usually big things that are a strict no for me. Right now I'm not looking for anyone else, because I want to see where this is going. More than one additional person at a time is too much stress for me, haha!

[Storm77]

Well personally I'm having way more difficulty with this than I thought I would especially when things start lacking at home :( With home environment, untrained loud pets (barking, shitting and peeing inside, I usually leave it for T and just put up with the smell as am sick of it), lack of privacy (with others in the house) to even "take care of myself" except for whenever T goes to sleep which is between 11pm sometimes till 4am then I have till about 5:30am to cyber, look at porn, etc to take care of my needs before others may wander out into the living room. Without other outlets it's being very difficult not to feel left out, tossed aside. Being angry this morning, came to realize with the date T had with S honestly he had more sex with T (which wasn't much) than I have got in likely over a month LOL.

We are both in a bad position, no vehicle, no money. Being female of course T got someone quickly who is willing to drive hours into town to take her out. So now I feel the need to just find anyone for a fuck just to have an outlet, to get out of here, someone to talk to without all the stress of home life. Honestly right now wish had a relationship to just get away from home for a few days to a week to just have a vacation and clear my mind. I find myself thinking back to the married woman I saw when I was very young (yes cougar type thing) and wishing where is someone like that now. I guess at 34 not really the young innocent type to be snatched up by an older woman anymore, lol.

I was on here thinking where the hell do I find locals accepting of Poly when being a male and married and poly seems like three strikes your out. It seems impossible to find a woman even open enough to chat with unless it's just someone looking just for sex, intimate encounters, unhappy married women looking to cheat, etc. Almost all "single" women are turned off at a married man, unless she is unhappy looking to cheat, just looking for casual encounters, etc but no relationship.

I think the "nice guy" and relationship expectations are going to fade fast here since I got the low-key semi-loving relationship at home. Really feeling the need for the spark, fire of passion, elsewhere even if it means just casual sex.

*sighs* It's an interesting journey, I felt I could not deny T of her relationship with S, so I do not really feel... or as hard as it is to say do not care what she thinks of whoever I find for a relationship, if I do, or whenever I do. At this moment my standards are way lower seeing it may be needed to find someone to accept me in this situation. (unless I lie, which I still refuse to do.)

Sorry to sound like a ranting angry child on here... just the brutal honesty of home life. Pretty much how it's been for years and sadly how it is staying. Aside from brief episodes of kink talking about the possibilities of what may come of polyamory or when T comes back from a date with S.

Find myself thinking how to rearrange our living room and bedroom for my privacy and possibly so we can actually have a few more options for sex *cough* whenever it happens with T so it's something other than just the bed on the floor. Almost anywhere else and someone can walk in on us, LOL. It'd be even safer outside in the covered side drive way of the house, the back yard, in one of the sheds :p it's dark at night, got a solid table and chairs out back and almost no chance of being seen. But the mosquitoes are a pain in every part of the naked body.

[JaneQSmythe]

It'd be even safer outside in the covered side drive way of the house, the back yard, in one of the sheds :p it's dark at night, got a solid table and chairs out back and almost no chance of being seen. But the mosquitoes are a pain in every part of the naked body.

I'm sorry you are feeling that you are in a difficult spot. Many posters here have lamented that it DOES seem easier for poly women than poly men to find potential partners. If you are not averse to casual sex I honestly don't see why that can't be a starting point - as long as you are honest (Yes, I am married. Yes, she is ok with it. Yes, I want sex. Yes, I am really looking for something more, but will settle for sex for now. No, I am NOT okay with participating in cheating.)

But the privacy thing really seems like it can be addressed if you are creative...(I must have missed your living situation - who the hell is wandering about at all hours?)

The bit that I quoted reminds me of a time period when Dude was broken up with his ex but she was still visiting here frequently and I didn't feel comfortable having sex with Dude with her in the house even if she was asleep. MrS suggested a blanket and the great outdoors...Dude rolled with the idea and picked a spot - IN THE DAMN FRONT YARD (seriously? 20+ acres to choose from and you pick one visible from the damn road?!) OTOH - I didn't notice the mosquitoes. Not. One. Damn. Bit.

JaneQ

PS. I'm working on how to be a good "wingman" for my boys if they ever decide to "branch out" - right now my plans are 1.) take them to some poly meetup in a nearby city 2.) take them to some hippy music fest type concerts, flirt with every female in sight and introduce them to my boys 3.) help them write up OKCupid profiles that would attract the type of girls that they think they like (i.e. a profile that I would like - I really have no other basis for comparison)

[Glitter]

It's my parents, they share our house with their own apartment. However they use our kitchen and main bathroom for showering. They don't wander out often, but my dad works early mornings, so he will walk out in the yard (not through our part), to head out for work.

[SNeacail]

Well personally I'm having way more difficulty with this than I thought I would especially when things start lacking at home :( With home environment, untrained loud pets (barking, shitting and peeing inside, I usually leave it for T and just put up with the smell as am sick of it), lack of privacy (with others in the house) to even "take care of myself" except for whenever T goes to sleep which is between 11pm sometimes till 4am then I have till about 5:30am to cyber, look at porn, etc to take care of my needs before others may wander out into the living room. Without other outlets it's being very difficult not to feel left out, tossed aside. Being angry this morning, came to realize with the date T had with S honestly he had more sex with T (which wasn't much) than I have got in likely over a month LOL.

It sounds like it's time to sit down and have a serious discussion on some of the things you guys need to work on. I know that to those that like to be surrounded by pets,they don't even realize that the smell can be absolutely nauseating to everyone else. Storm, if you think this is a real problem (which it sounds like you do), make sure Glitter knows it and the two of you sit down and figure out a plan of action to fix it. Same goes for more privacy and being more intimate with each other.

[Storm77]

@JaneQSmythe - As for the casual sex, I've always been that bloody innocent type which prefers to not have sex unless there is a damn good chance of a relationship. I know most guys would have their jaws drop going WTF!?!?!?! I don't know... It would be a bit much to explain how I felt through the last 2-3 friends/relationships like that. Basically I walked away from each friendship, getting serious when they would not commit or even acknowledge we were close but threw sex on the table like it's totally nothing lets just fuck! which leads me to think hmm really so how many guys are you banging besides me... half the city?

I posted on another topic how I think I have more of a stereotypical "female" or fem personality. I'm more emotional, sensitive, seem to be always giving, always trying to help, always trying to "make things work" putting my own feelings aside to save those of others till I finally explode at some point. I don't give a shit about "acting manly" as many guys do if I'm called a pussy or gay as I have been so many times I just laugh and think yeah "typical male... PIG!" sometimes I really do hate having to be with the same label as every other man.

As for privacy, I do feel safe wearing my boxers and no shirt at night when her parents are asleep from about 9pm till 5:30am... After that I can't excatly be *cough* taking care of my needs as the door they open to enter the living room is only about 5 feet away and in plain sight... *looks over* well from the back and side view, lol. Otherwise we have 5 cats, 2 med/large dogs, a mouse, 2 rats, and 2 bearded dragons... it's mainly the dogs and cats which make our personal time very difficult in the living room. Even to cuddle and watch a movie we go into the bedroom and watch it on the tv there.

;) about the front yard, we have a solid wood table on the side of the house, driveway but huge tarp like a cover for a camper over it so it's more of a sitting area, we like to eat outside when it's comfortable. I did some prep placement etc and it would work great for some fun.

@SNeacail - We did yet *sighs* again tonight. These same issues and problems have been ongoing for years! My/our first time suggesting another woman move in with us was mainly to help in this area lacking. We knew nothing of poly back then but besides the sex for me it was also to help with income having a roommate paying part of the rent and extra being in some sorta of relationship with her.

I guess the biggest problem is (no offense to women) I must really be like a chick. I always want to cuddle, fondle, etc. I need to have touching as signs of affection showing T does love me, wants me, needs me. I also DO love when she does the wifey things sometimes like making us dinner, sitting outside eating then holding hands while talking.

As of the last month I finally after telling her for years what I like, what makes me feel good I was blunt and while cuddling in bed after a hot fantasy about S and P, I told her but I NEED her to open up, saying "You don't have to tell me your deep dark fantasies I know that would be private but... being totally honest, nothing taboo I mean nothing! What would would turn you on right now..." As she started to think I added "...to me!" with a grin.

That is when our other play started and I felt so much more connected being able to openly be a bit submissive and have her willing to fulfill and meet those needs. It was bliss and still keeps things exciting daily and is part of helping her open up, become more sexually empowered.

Now sure if anyone knows of the movie "Secretary" ;) basically a sub guiding, training someone to become a Dom. Although not quite at the point yet of pissing her off to get a good punishment :o LOL.

After a loooong day, I think she was very hurt when I dumped everything out. About the lack sex, about how "since I had no choice with S I really don't give a shit what you think about anyone I get! Even if it's someone you hate, you know like Niclole! (a woman we knew and later found out shes a hooker) It's about time I get MY needs met! After all isn't that why were doing this damn thing! Basically that it's like I am a cockold but I'm not getting any of my needs met out of it. We CANNOT be in this situation now while doing this NOT ANYMORE! Not when we are BOTH getting our needs met elsewhere because you bloody well you know what happens!

It's not like I'm bragging but as I've vented my issues about our marriage to various people over the years the responses has been "Why the fuck to you put up with that!?" "She doesn't know what she has and likely never will till she loses it" I've been told several times if I'm that unhappy leave T.. and this was NOT by other women who wanted me for themselves but random people I'd chat with online. Even before the talk of a woman joining us, a few girls said they would "help out" if I needed it... but stupid as I am I just cannot do that, NOT cheat and NOT just casual sex. I've told T several times over the last 10 years and yes I guess it sounded blunt and scary. I told her I will NEVER cheat on you, if it gets so bad I will let you know it's over! We can talk about it, but yeah.

We did talk ALOT about it tonight as I was scared, yeah even crying since I think was the first time ever it felt like my body, love, etc shut down today she tried to hug and do the things we normally do... but nothing, even tho I'm a guy. It's bloody sucks with "this I gotta be in it for the emotional connection" crap.

Repeated for like the 10th 20th time how yes I talk about sex, NO I in NO WAY have a problem with her and S having sex. But you know, do you love me? do you find me attractive? do you want me? do you need me?

I was going to go on but a area which may have been to private so I asked T's permission if I could be open and say it here. ...and we got debating if she actually had sex with S so I'll wrap this up.

My response to equal hers was "If I had a lapse and accepted someone like Laura (girl we both think is slutty and she hates) if we both got naked, I started to have sex "it was only partly in, it was just maybe 2 seconds if even that." before I decided OMG I CAN'T do this!

Was it sex? or in my case did I cheat? :p

Anyways I think we're good won't be dragging this into an argument but seems T and I have different idea of what sex is. But seems if this situation personally applied to me. It's not sex in her opinion. Yay! I can have sex and it's not cheating as long as I only go partially in and only 2 seconds at a time LOL. Will have to found out how many seconds must it be out before entering it again to have a reset on the timer so it continues to not count and not be considered cheating in my case.

Sorry being silly, *deep breath* hopefully we're good I think I just have to be more on top of things reminding her of what I want. Instead of waiting to feel loved by her as I usually have. She is more like the man, going OMG what!? You never said you wanted... VS myself emotional well if you cared, blah blah whaaaa you'd have. Yup! We're screwed up at times :D

[Glitter]

Will have to found out how many seconds must it be out before entering it again to have a reset on the timer so it continues to not count and not be considered cheating in my case.

Ooooh, you are a bad bunny ;)

Ahem, we did get our needs met, several times ;) We may have some heated moments, but they certainly make for great make up nookie :cool:

[Storm77]

Gonna be bad if we get into personal chat back and forth on here since we are sitting about 3 feet between eachother :p

Yeah I was going to end it on that good note about the sex but kinda got distracted with the debate we had going on.

So yeah I can't argue maybe it doesn't count when you compare it time wise ;)

*bad bunny waits for a sore tail later*

[SNeacail]

Instead of waiting to feel loved by her as I usually have. She is more like the man, going OMG what!? You never said you wanted... VS myself emotional well if you cared, blah blah whaaaa you'd have. Yup! We're screwed up at times :D

My husband and I spent a lot of years doing this :rolleyes:. He needed "touch", and I needed "acts of service". Of course, what happened was that, I couldn't stand to touch him (or be touched) because he wouldn't help me around the house and vice versa. It wasn't until I discovered "The 5 Love Languages" that we finally had that AH HA moment. Neither of us understood how the lack of these things was part of what was tearing us apart. We spent nearly 20 years building resentments and walls between each other :(, that we are just now starting to break down.

Seriously, COMMUNICATION is absolute key to a relationship, especially if you're living together. We may think we are expressing our needs, wishes, desires, etc., when in fact it's being interpreted completely different. Get books, websites, etc on how to communicate, start with a "tag search" on this forum there's lots of great information and little tricks that are very helpful.

[Storm77]

Well not going on and on to cause problems... we're doing pretty good today but as I am typing this it's turning into giving our history and I guess my thinking out loud or in txt.

Yeah T and I have been that bad, I believe that was our worst time at the old apartment. The resentment grew, I daily said how it feels like we're just roommates, I thought of her as a lazy child, like I was a parent that had to take care of my kid. I was in the same boat, I felt sick, disgusted when she would touch me, even when I was horny it was at the point thinking "with you!?" Yeah it may be personal but others may have had it happen when it's so bad the body just doesn't respond.

She's always been ok if I looked at porn, cybered, etc since I worked with adult websites even before we met. I think that was the bottom of the pit if that was not there I would have not had anything stopping my fall. It would have been over years ago when we hit those worst times.

Thinking of S and P as I type this...

I would call her my kid in a joking way just to deal with it, a way to just cope with it all. Till one day I was babying her on the street asking if shes ok and she snapped saying QUIT TREATING ME LIKE A FUCKING CHILD! My response was QUIT ACTING LIKE ONE! I NOT A PEDO, I MARRIED A WOMAN WHERE THE FUCK DID SHE GO!? as I gentle shook her shoulders looking into her eyes. Shes has such a huge wall up I guess it cracked a little that day.

The biggest problem over the years. I'm passive, I'll do my part but wait to see if she loves me (from my pov) if she will follow true on her promises to talk, to work on our relationship. When she flakes out I feel hurt and stop working on it too, the resentment builds. Till it builds weeks later when I insult her or my anger and resentment shows. Then she is surprised asking where the hell did this come from, what did I do!? We have been doing so good... Not from my perspective.

That has been the history of our relationship since early on (over 10 years), I wait for her to show she loves me when she doesn't show it (in a way I can understand) I don't want to hurt her, I bottle up the pain and feelings of neglect as long as I possibly can till it needs to come out somewhere. I explode, I yell telling her how I feel, shes shocked, cries.. We both cry, both promise to do what is needed to keep the relationship going. I feel in bliss for 1-2 days, 3-4 coming down slowly slide to normal. 4th plus shes mostly back to our :( normal as it were. But yes the problem is I never remind her, I figured she made the promises if she loves me and cares about the relationship isn't it important enough to remember and continue to work on it.

I was worried yesterday with my feelings. With the thought of how yeah the sex was balanced or lack there of when I'm her husband, I'm the primary. Of course this shot up the feelings of does she really love me... as much... feelings spinning out of control. Further increasing my panic to find my 2nd relationship, as I wrote thinking should I just look for whoever I can get, for whatever I can get to keep this relationship together.

It's been maybe 5 years since I "shut down" like I did... again. She had no clue as we lay in bed asking what's wrong. In my mind I was thinking to myself FUaaaaaaCK is it over!? If I find someone I like to meet my needs, if T and I ignore our issues as usual. We will both have an "out" now. Will she take hers, will I take mine or just continue in pain, or will the my 2nd help to null our primary problems.

I can't remember what I said next I was too out of it, something about if we break up. More of a possibility since we opened this damn door.

Well... Aug 13th - Day 1...

[Storm77]

@JaneQSmythe
Many posters here have lamented that it DOES seem easier for poly women than poly men to find potential partners.

It's pretty much the same anywhere even in general dating sites. Sometimes the men outnumber women 10to1, 3to1 would be the lowest possible I'd think. Plus add on general dating sites many people are turned-off or even disgusted by Polyamory as I said before it's like a 3 strikes your out everytime. I'm a common Male among hundreds, I'm married, I'm Poly and looking for another woman. The only people who seem to be ok with that all is swingers and unhappy married women looking to cheat. Now that T is with S and I'd be without a "female" for the swingers lessens that chance... I think. Never really looked into what swingers want but again with it being just sex that's a turn-off unless he is bi too, some fetishes were involved to add that spark. I did *in a shuffling my feet sorta way* bring up the idea the idea to T about would she... be willing to try again with a new couple if we could find one. (Still keep S but possibly...) She said she'd have to really like the guy she wouldn't just fuck around... Thought about it and then LOL'ed. She asked what! Said "Well with my luck, what if AGAIN... you develop feelings for the man, the wife doesn't work out with me and you got TWO GUYS and I'm still zip, nada, zero, LOL" Now THAT would be a FML moment! :p

As for casual sex, I really don't know. Yes I LOVE sex like any guy but I'm way more about the emotional side of things unless the partner and I could cook up some sort of fantasy or be into fetishes that turn me on just having a woman laying there silent to screw it'd be slim chance of having an orgasm without some kind of interaction, emotions, feelings, etc.

On top of that it's always been difficult to not get attached, not develop love for someone, I always have that feeling and need I'm attracted to you, thus I love you, thus I want some type of relationship. I know it's different being Poly but as T says I'm still thinking like a Mono too often. *shrugs* That is just one part of me I don't know how to change right now. Even since a teenager since I was first interested in girls, yes some were hot but 2nd thought was and still IS always "what is she like?" going out with, living with, what is her personality, etc not like most guys thinking who cares I so want to BANG HER right NOW!

I have a damn good relationship with T, I don't mind she's with another man since we share a very strong connection as it is. With a new woman I'm not sure if I would still feel hurt knowing shes with a bunch of other guys and without the "connection" I can just get off faster myself with some good porn or just my imagination ;) *thinking here* I guess I see it as something like paying a hooker, just do it, no feelings, go home. I could use the $200 for WAY better things :p

There was one woman's profile I saw locally OKC who I kept telling T would be FUCKING PERFECT. WOW! married, older, beautiful, a dom, had thoughts she mmm could break my being bi-curious if I don't have a choice :o following her orders hehe being bi-curious gotta admit I have thought about M/F couples before. With being older, a dom AND fetishes that would have been some damn good connections and sparks... fuck that it would be a raging forest fire! (But never got a response back from her and likely blew it since this was before T gave me some advice on how to make my profiles, write messages, etc.) it was a 1st message TMI B-O-M-B. I really liked her so thought OMG I gotta tell her EVERYTHING!!! More chance she'll see something in there she likes about me. Sent it. When I asked T later what she thought of it, she was stunned. (In a jaw dropping to the floor way straight outa the movie The Mask) Pretty much said WTF you sent here e-v-e-r-y-t-h-i-n-g, showed all your cards, whats left to talk about! Nothing. T-M-I!

Now I try to go by what she says, 3 paragraphs 4 max if you need. Intro, something relating about her and wrap it up with looking forward to contact, how to, etc. Instead of a first message being 5-7 pages long :o

@SNeacail
My husband and I spent a lot of years doing this :rolleyes:. He needed "touch", and I needed "acts of service". Of course, what happened was that, I couldn't stand to touch him (or be touched) because he wouldn't help me around the house and vice versa. It wasn't until I discovered "The 5 Love Languages" that we finally had that AH HA moment. Neither of us understood how the lack of these things was part of what was tearing us apart.

I'm trying to think back, I think I've told T at least a few times over the years what I like, what I need about the touching. Previously her issue was touching, led to fondling which led to sex and I guess with her feelings of me that was a big no way!

Add there was and still is times she acts like shes turned on, says we'll do something that night. It never happens, I know now because I never remind her and I have to remember that. I'd wait and wait, it gets later and I think she's just going to let me down again, it's what always happens. She gets tired ready for bed, sometimes I'd not say a word and just feel hurt other times I'd say something and she would just say she's "sorry I promise tomorrow" same thing happens. It got to the point I would joke or mock her when she made those promises "Oooh I'm so gonna jump you tonight!" sometimes it was really hard not to laugh at her, sometimes I'd just nod go about my day, never shower or anything *shrugs* because I knew what to expect from her, it wouldn't happen. I'd take care of myself on the computer, etc crawl into bed later.

It was pretty much to the point we never talked to eachother except for good morning, love you, love you too. Hours later, what do you want for dinner? whose making dinner, are there any clean dishes? Lastly she says ok I'm going to bed, ok love you, love you too. This while like now we spend almost all our time at home sitting 5 feet away from eachother... Yet I felt so alone.

It's no where that bad now, things are WAY BETTER in this house since we moved from our last place. But there still are the moments. One of my last rants here was after 4 days of those "promises" but yes my fault too since I'm used to how we work, she promises of something and I take the path of well I'll believe it when it happens and not remind her thinking if she cares she'll remember about me.

I can see and know I have to change my biggest fault. Killing a good relationship between us by being passive then hurt and yeah that is part of the communication.

Anyways long post as usual. Wanted to add that 5languages of love results I got.


10 Quality Time (listed #1)
10 Physical Touch
7 Acts of Service
3 Words of Affirmation
0 Receiving Gifts

For anyone wondering about this test
5 Love Languages (http://www.5lovelanguages.com/assessments/love/)

[SNeacail]

Add there was and still is times she acts like shes turned on, says we'll do something that night. It never happens, I know now because I never remind her and I have to remember that. I'd wait and wait, it gets later and I think she's just going to let me down again, it's what always happens. She gets tired ready for bed, sometimes I'd not say a word and just feel hurt other times I'd say something and she would just say she's "sorry I promise tomorrow" same thing happens. It got to the point I would joke or mock her when she made those promises "Oooh I'm so gonna jump you tonight!" sometimes it was really hard not to laugh at her, sometimes I'd just nod go about my day, never shower or anything *shrugs* because I knew what to expect from her, it wouldn't happen. I'd take care of myself on the computer, etc crawl into bed later.

It was pretty much to the point we never talked to eachother except for good morning, love you, love you too. Hours later, what do you want for dinner? whose making dinner, are there any clean dishes? Lastly she says ok I'm going to bed, ok love you, love you too. This while like now we spend almost all our time at home sitting 5 feet away from each other... Yet I felt so alone.

Please don't take this wrong, but ROFLMAO:D!

It is absolutely a lonely way to live! This was almost exactly my life for a very long time. What I learned and am still trying to teach my husband. SPEAK UP - IN THE OUT LOUD VOICE! I am not a mind reader. Both of us would sit around waiting for the other to "make a move" and then both get irritated and feel slighted when it didn't happen.

I still have to remind my husband that just because I seem tired or involved with something, don't assume I won't drop it in an instant if he voices that he'd like sex or cuddle time, etc. Also don't assume that I can read all the non-verbal hints, because after 20 years, we've established that I CAN'T. There may be times, when I'm not feeling up to sex, but would be happy with cuddling. In the same light, it also works in reverse. Life is so much better when we actually VOICE (in the out loud voice:p) our needs, wants and desires. Our partner may actually surprise us and be up to grant it. We still have times where we slip back into old habits, but we're learning and working on it.

Love Language:
I'm - Acts of Service & Quality Time - about equally
Husband - #1 Touch & #2 Words of Affirmation

Knowing each others language has made a great difference. I can make the effort to touch him when I walk through the room or reach out a hand or foot while trying to sleep. The more we have touched, the more I crave and need it also, to the point where it's vying for position with the other two languages. In turn, he has made a bigger effort to give me help when I ask for it.

You mentioned earlier that you would whine about stuff. I found that this is NOT communicating and the recipient tends to tune you out at this point. State the problem, then ask how are WE going to fix it. Now a discussion can start and the recipient isn't feeling attacked. Know your audience, I have a tendency to think out loud and need to list all the difference scenarios, which just looses my husband. He will either just assume I have picked either the first one or the last one and there is nothing for him to do or contribute. I've had to learn to just state the problem and wait for him to answer, although I do have to remind and prod him to fill me in on his decision or line of thinking.

It seems like writing down some of your thought is helpful to you, keep doing it. Many of us find that helpful, as you can see from the blog section:p.

[Glitter]

I'm trying to think back, I think I've told T at least a few times over the years what I like, what I need about the touching. Previously her issue was touching, led to fondling which led to sex and I guess with her feelings of me that was a big no way!

Just want to pop in here and say my problems/issues had nothing to do with my feelings for you! They were my own insecurities and allowing myself to be controlled by past happenings (newly discovered memories of being molested as a child). I allowed my own fears and hurts guide my value as a woman, as a person. Nothing you could have said or done would have changed that. It was and is all on me. If I continue to allow such things to be my guide as to how I should behave and react, then I will get no where fast.

Add there was and still is times she acts like shes turned on, says we'll do something that night. It never happens, I know now because I never remind her and I have to remember that. I'd wait and wait, it gets later and I think she's just going to let me down again, it's what always happens. She gets tired ready for bed, sometimes I'd not say a word and just feel hurt other times I'd say something and she would just say she's "sorry I promise tomorrow" same thing happens. It got to the point I would joke or mock her when she made those promises "Oooh I'm so gonna jump you tonight!" sometimes it was really hard not to laugh at her, sometimes I'd just nod go about my day, never shower or anything *shrugs* because I knew what to expect from her, it wouldn't happen. I'd take care of myself on the computer, etc crawl into bed later.

(snipped)

It's no where that bad now, things are WAY BETTER in this house since we moved from our last place. But there still are the moments. One of my last rants here was after 4 days of those "promises" but yes my fault too since I'm used to how we work, she promises of something and I take the path of well I'll believe it when it happens and not remind her thinking if she cares she'll remember about me.

I can see and know I have to change my biggest fault. Killing a good relationship between us by being passive then hurt and yeah that is part of the communication.

This is also something I need to work on. I have shitty short term memory, mainly due to medication I've been on. I have to work on the follow-through on my end. If I promise something, I have to do it. Otherwise don't promise it ;)

I also need to speak up and voice my needs and wants. It's been getting easier, for sure ;) But it's a life time of repressing what I want and need that I am fighting (as you know, for you it is a life time of being the good guy and not bluntly saying what you want or need). But we're getting a hell of a lot better at it (thinks of last night) :D


These are my Love Languages:

Love Language Scores:
7 Words of Affirmation
8 Quality Time
7 Receiving Gifts
4 Acts of Service
4 Physical Touch
Interpreting and Using Your Profile Score:
The highest score indicates your primary love language (the highest score is 12). It's not uncommon to have two high scores, although one language does have a slight edge for most people. That just means two languages are important to you. The lower scores indicate those languages you seldom use to communicate love and which probably don't affect you very much on an emotional level.


I'd like to point out that the gifts I desire are small things, like a little post it note with I Love You Honey on it. I don't care for material things, $$$, etc...I like it when my love spends time on something (like a doodle, a mixed tape, etc) for me :)

[Glitter]

Also don't assume that I can read all the non-verbal hints, because after 20 years, we've established that I CAN'T.

Haha, this is me! I am oblivious! I never ever caught on to these things, so unless it is voiced, I am not going to "get" it, haha! :p

[Glitter]

Been a long few days. Some good some not so good. Today I kind of fell apart, realizing I don't have a whole lot of support. My mum seems to think I am going to run off with my boyfriend (was S, now calling him Music).

Turns out my dad (step dad)'s parents were poly and in a quad relationship for years. His mum left his dad for her lover. They married and were together for 25+ years until he passed away last year. She thinks I will run away with Music and leave Storm all alone. She doesn't see the good in this relationship, only the potential bad. I do understand her fears, but I wish she (and others) would understand that I am not stupid, nor would I ever just up and leave my marriage!

Now, I don't usually value my family's opinion that much when it comes to my love life, but I felt a huge let down. If Music and I stay together for the long haul (which is what we are planning), he will be a part of my family unit. Anyone wanting to stay in my life will need to accept that and him. I'm not asking them to jump on board and love him, but respect and acceptance is needed.

I am glad that we are taking it slow. Music has come out to some of his friends, and introduced me as his girlfriend. I am finding that P (whom I will call Petal), seems jealous about me, but in an indirect way. She is quick to point out that she is the primary and that she had Music first. I let her know I am fine being the secondary, because we're just dating at this point and there is no need for rumble-strutting (anyone with guinea pigs may understand this, it's like stomping around, puffing up and being the bigger pig, but it's usually only a dominance thing, not truly leading to fighting).

Anyways, I got to chat with Music tonight, and I feel better. He said that I just need to love myself, Storm and whomever I want to love. And that he will be there when I need to talk, which is lovely.

Next thing is for me to meet up with my bestie and talk to her. She knows nothing about this, except that we've been talking about it for years. I really need a day out, ha!

On a good note, I am planning my next date with Music. Planning on going to the movies (I have free passes) and maybe some start watching by the lake. Nothing fancy, just love and fun :)

[Glitter]

Well, Petal has all but stopped talking to me. She won't respond to me when we're in group chat, nor to anything I post on FB. I am thinking maybe I should remove her from FB or something, because it's weird being ignored like this.

After spending 2 hours chatting with Music on Skype, he informed me he is on the verge of formally ending it with her. He's discovered that she is saying how "disgusted" she is about his physical appearance to everyone but him. He's pissed about it, since she's also gained weight over the last 5 years.

We've been discussing hanging out more (Storm, Music and I), so that the men can become friends, and we can all be comfortable with the V relationship. I would love for both men to be friends. They don't need to be best buds or anything, but friends with mutual respect would be a good fit ;)

Oh! Storm is on the phone, right now, with a woman :D I know, it's not much, but this is the first step for him, the first woman interested in getting to know him :D I am so proud I could burst! I hope it all goes well, he's been chatting for nearly an hour ;)

Music and I are planning a date end of the month, beginning of September. Depends on if we have the money to meet. I may take the bus out there for a bit, if things are ok (meaning if Petal is no longer there, as it would be awkward and not polite on my part to visit while they are not in a good place). Otherwise he will come out here. Storm helps me to plan out dates, what to do that's cheap or free, where to go for star gazing and snuggling, etc. I'm glad he's so supportive! He really is an amazing man <3

We lost a few pets this week :( My guinea pig died, then my mouse, and on Saturday we have to send my Golden Retriever puppy back to the breeder. We're slowly cutting down on pets, though we've had 8 die in the past year alone. It's getting sad.

[Glitter]

Well, things came to head tonight. Music broke my #1 Rule: You have NO RIGHT to demand I leave Storm. Even if things get bumpy with he and I, we are married and NO ONE has the right to tell me what to do. Thus, Music is no more. Oh well, I'm actually not very bummed by it. Says a lot :p

[Storm77]

Well we've had our own issues but lately I try to deal with it quicker directly with Glitter rather than venting on here or anywhere else. Tonight we had a massive blow up while I thought we would be dealing with things and calming the situation down out on a 5k walk.

I did mention people keep telling me grow-up, grow a set of balls, etc (even by Glitter) and yes I did tell someone I'm not sure how much more I can take in our marriage and if I should start preparing for a break-up with Glitter as things continue going downhill and we both are feeling hurt more and more. This was pounced on by Petal (or whatever the heck her name is now lol) she instantly started a group chat for counseling, Petal and Music on voice, Glitter and myself typing and it was extremely hard to follow to say the least!

Three of four of us were very angry and all ranting, eventually Petal turned into bashing and picking a side too. Accusations back and forth. I even bluntly said don't you think it's a little weird Music in here *cough* helping us with OUR relationship and our marriage when ofc he's jumping on every little thing bashing me since he likes Glitter and I'm made out to by the "bad guy"

So yeah it didn't end to well when Music threatening to bash my face in if he sees me. After the chat ended with alot of fuck yous and come say that to my face!!! I told Glitter Music pretty much sealed the deal he is NEVER welcome in our house EVER and in fact I do NOT want him on our property as he does have violence problems since childhood and it continues to this day and I would also take ANY measures to defend myself! Since he's bragged what he's capable of. They could still date I have always said I'm not jealous but yeah she would have to meet him elsewhere not be picked up at home.

I was also feeling guilty as just yesterday I was telling Glitter how if Music and I could spend more time hanging-out, if I got to know the side Glitter sees not the asshole ego side I think we could be good friends and it would go a long ways to build a trust in him even to the point of us all being "comfortable" *cough* with whatever in our own home. Sighs, how quickly things change :(

On the positive side with our blow-up (Glitter and I) had tonight then the blow-up with all 4 of us in chat, this drastically renewed the idea of looking at working at our relationship and counseling both personal and marriage since we are both bringing our own problems and baggage into any new relationships and it's causing alot of sparks to fly... and NOT in a good way LOL.

I'm REALLY hoping we can make it out to our local munch next month and it would be so nice if we could take things slower as we better ourselves, make new friends "meaning friends only" into Poly or an alternative lifestyle and have that boost within our relationship being able to just hang out with other people as friends. Ease the stress of our lives and our relationship having people outside our family and relationship to talk with, hang-out with, etc.

Without the panic race with either of us in the OMG I NEED to find a relationship NOW!!! (so I feel better... meaning glitter or myself. We both tend to want to jump right in to get that feeling.)

[SNeacail]

I can tell you that it is worth it if you can work on the relationship between the two of you. It is NOT a fast fix! There will be set backs! It is worth it.

For me, after we started working with a counselor, things seemed to get better right away, until our next big fight and the feeling of hopelessness and absolute despair seemed to hit harder. This was extremely hard for me to deal with. However, we were able to recover faster. We have been working on things for 2 years now and while things are much better than they have been in nearly 15 years, there no where near where I think they should be. I still have doubts and wish I could afford to go back into counceling. 21 years of bad communication habits are hard to break.

Good luck!

[Storm77]

It will be very difficult... I am pushing for us to work on things, for Glitter to pick up and follow through on her tasks. ie once case we were about to give up one of our dogs we've only had for about a month since he's not trained in anything including housebroken and Glitter always forgets to work with him. So tonight we talked about it she agreed it's ok if I kick her ass reminding her she NEEDS to work with him. On my end I'll have to take our other dog out for a walk or in the yard to play so she can train the other.

As for the poly situation, I wish things could be slowed down NOT close the door on as she panics but just work on us FIRST at least for a while as it may be unneeded worrying but I do worry things may just revert to the problems we have been feeling now but all over again.

Last night was the first time as my name goes I STORMED off, I didn't want to sleep in the same bed with her, while I would never hit her I just felt stay away from me you #&@!$ first time I seriously considered is it over?! How can I prepare for the break-up so I'm not homeless on the street. Find friends or someone else for support, maybe a relationship. Hell maybe if I was someones slave 24/7 the mind just tossing out any options which may be possible. I used to be depressed and yes had thoughts of that which we should never mention, lol. Now sine Poly opened up it's more anger and the thoughts it's not like we're "stuck together" anymore. If she can't suck it up help me, help us, help the relationship while it is difficult there may be other options out there.

I've finally came out and told her each time we're fighting and she yells "grow a set of fucking balls" I'm no longer the depressed "nice guy" feeling worthless, I have bloody options now. She opened up that Poly door and never wants to close it so yes when I'm PISSED at home ofc I'm thinking man it would be so great having a woman who actually wants a relationship and is willing to make it work, to feel happy with. everytime we fight and she tells me this she just doesn't know what she is encouraging.

She keeps saying I need to balls up and contact more women that's the only way I can find someone. I guess when we fight now I'm more and more thinking it's just natural, if we are unstable, if I feel like shit at home with her... common sense is I'd rather be with another woman, anyone that makes me feel better than our issues which are never getting dealt with.

We do have plans to work on things, schedules, counseling, maybe up my meds, change hers... I just really fukin hope we can BOTH follow through on all this to help us stay together!

[Glitter]

So. this week has been one massive, interesting, annoying, satisfying and confusing week. Storm has let me know that he is NOT ok with poly. At least that is what I think he said. He's not outright said if he has an issue with it or not. He worries that I will neglect him, so for now I've removed my profiles and am not seeking any outside relationships. I want him to feel secure and loved, before adding in any more ingredients to the pot.

This is a bit tough for me. Not the not seeking others. Just knowing, having experienced it, that I am poly. Storm has not been with anyone else, so I don't know what he thinks of that (is he? isn't he? etc).

I have learned and now understand that he does enjoy my energy when I am pursuing another (or am being pursued). He says that he does not have problems with me dating another. I think the problems come when he knows the person. He has long hated most typical males, and that is a trigger for him. Do I simply not introduce them? Wait until it is more than a date or two before introducing? Ugh, I've never been in this spot, and am completely confused.

So I don't know what to do.

Do I close the poly door and hide what I really want, who I am, for the sake of my husband's feelings? Do I take this break, and later (say a month or however long it need be) silently start seeking another? Do I seek regardless? I won't do that, it isn't who I am. I am just having a lot of things go through my head.

Will he ever be "ok" with me dating another? I'm not looking for someone to move in, to be my life partner, etc. I am wanting a guy to date. To have fun. To do different things with, that Storm and I do not do (e.g. camping, fishing, art galleries, etc). I'm not looking to replace him, by any means. I want someone else, as well as him. Am I being greedy?

[nycindie]

I think you both had this idea that once you decided to open up your relationship, you should both then pursue other people and everything would be equal. Storm seemed to be mostly upset that he couldn't find anyone while you had. Thing is, it's not a race. Equanimity is not the same as equal. Life happens as it happens, and you can't expect both of you to find partners at the exact same time.

I think it's good that you're taking a break from poly, because it also seems that you do need to both work on being more compassionate and giving toward each other before being intimate with other people. Build the foundation of your relationship to be stronger and more loving. Focus on being kind to each other yet direct and honest, and look inwardly at yourselves to see where the fears, insecurities, and addictions are. I think perhaps you may need to change a few things in your home environment, too.

When it feels right, and not a moment before, you can spend some more time discussing and figuring out exactly what kind of non-monogamy is reasonable for you. Accept fully that it could even be a year or two or more of one of you having an additional partner while the other one doesn't. If each of you are centered within yourselves, and in a strong place in your relationship, that should be much easier to accept and handle. Then, take baby steps.

[Glitter]

Thank you Cindie! Last night as I was heading for bed (he wanted to stay up and play WoW, I had a tooth ache, so early night for me), I told him I had posted on here if he wanted to read it and see if there is more we needed to talk about. Turns out he had wanted to talk about it all night, but it was our date night (aka our Gordon Ramsey night), and he knew it would end up being a good hour or more long convo if he brought it up during the shows.

So we lay in bed, talking about what we want to do (take it slow), what we want for each other (starting to attend monthly Munch's, and get to know more people in the kink community, without there being any pressure), and what we'd like in the future (I don't want a second husband, I want to date a man or woman, or both or either, and do things every now and then, that Storm doesn't enjoy, such as camping, art museums, horror movies, etc).

We spent a good amount of time just talking. It was wonderful that it came from an honest place, and not out of anger, hurt or worry. No tears, nothing angry, etc. It was good!

We decided to make friends first...so that there is some sort of foundation. If anything becomes more for either of us, then wonderful. But we're not pushing for each other to find another person, etc. No more racing. No more trying to force something that isn't there.

We also set up some boundaries so that we can share some aspects (for example, if I am chatting with someone from OKC, then I can tell him I'm chatting with a friend, and leave it at that - if it's a cyber convo, I can share parts of it later, that help he and I enjoy our sexy time together; he can do the same, he need not tell me everything and can share what he feels comfortable with sharing).

We both understand that this can and will take time to develop. No need to run head first into a brick wall, haha. I know women have a tendency to get more responses on dating sites (I get many every day, but honestly 99% are nothing I would reply to), but hopefully Storm now sees it as I've been seeing it:

QUANTITY =/= QUALITY

Meaning many fish swim by, but I'm looking for something very specific, and won't be trying to catch and bring home all of them :p

I've also realized that I honestly don't want another husband. I am not looking for a life partner, because I have no desire to replace Storm. He's my main squeeze, I love him and it's for life. Anyone extra is simply that, extra.

I compare it to eating chicken fingers (I know, weird!): we both love the chicken finger platter from Denny's, and we always get honey mustard dipping sauce. But every now and then, I would love to try a sweet and sour sauce, a BBQ sauce, etc. Doesn't mean I will change and only want the others, because my honey mustard is my favorite and my staple. I just like a taste of the others now and then.

Ok, I shall shut up now :p I can feel the pain killers (for my broken tooth) still working and I am rambling off again. Storm did say he read this and was hoping others would jump in and offer advice, so thank you again Cindie ;) I'm also very glad that he and I are on the same table and are not closing the door entirely, just taking it much slower ;)

[JaneQSmythe]

We decided to make friends first...so that there is some sort of foundation. If anything becomes more for either of us, then wonderful.

This would be my approach as well. While I can have NSA sex with people that I am only physically attracted to, I can't imagine having an actual relationship with someone unless I would want to be friends with them regardless.



I've also realized that I honestly don't want another husband. I am not looking for a life partner, because I have no desire to replace Storm. He's my main squeeze, I love him and it's for life. Anyone extra is simply that, extra.

I think that it is perfectly fine to say up front what you are looking for - an "extra" guy to date and do things with that Storm doesn't enjoy. I would be careful though of completely ruling out the "life partner option" and making promises to that effect - you can't always predict the twists and turns that your life and loves will take. I've identified as poly for 20 years and always assumed that, as a bi-girl, any serious OSO would be female - so I could have "one of each" - but then I went and fell for a 2nd guy...

I wouldn't count Dude as a "life partner" just yet (we have only been together for 17 months) but it could turn out that way - he's lived with us the whole time and it is his stated desire to be around for "a long time". If it sticks then what? MrS gets booted? HELL NO! I'll simply have two "life partners" - one of whom is also my husband.


I compare it to eating chicken fingers (I know, weird!): we both love the chicken finger platter from Denny's, and we always get honey mustard dipping sauce. But every now and then, I would love to try a sweet and sour sauce, a BBQ sauce, etc. Doesn't mean I will change and only want the others, because my honey mustard is my favorite and my staple. I just like a taste of the others now and then.

OK, fair enough analogy. You know you will ALWAYS like honey mustard - not a problem, no doubts there. But what if Denny's develops some brand new "Ultra Ranch AWESOME Sauce"? You like it too. As much as you like honey mustard. You've been eating honey mustard for years...you're not bored with it but you know most of what it has to offer.

You would likely have some kind of NRE experience with your new taste sensation - ordering it 2 out of 3 times and checking in with honey mustard every third time just to confirm that you like it as much as you always have - YOU DO. In fact, you appreciate it even more because you have some contrast to compare it to which causes you to notice all of the things that drew you to honey mustard in the first place - things that you had forgotten because you were used to how it tasted.

Then the NRE settles down - AWESOME sauce "catches up" with honey mustard (because you have been eating a LOT of it). Actually, now that you have been choosing AWESOME sauce so often you begin to see it's flaws - still love it, but honey mustard has some attributes that AWESOME sauce lacks. AWESOME sauce is now a staple as well. Different but equally satisfying. Sometimes you are in the mood for one, sometimes the other - and SOMETIMES (>gasp<:eek:) you throw caution to the wind and order BOTH.

I guess my point is - you haven't tasted AWESOME sauce yet...it hasn't been invented. Your present self can't make promises about how your future self will feel about AWESOME sauce. You CAN say that you know that honey mustard will always be your staple, that you will never NOT like honey mustard. You CAN say that none of the other sauces you have ever tried has come close to what honey mustard has to offer...but you can't say that none ever will.

(It took me 19 years to run into my own personal "AWESOME sauce"...I wasn't really looking, then again I wasn't really looking when I found my honey mustard. Keeping your taste buds open to new experiences can lead to...new experiences.)

Jane("I-like-honey-mustard-AND-ranch")Q

[Glitter]

So true JaneQ! I hadn't really thought about that...if I attempt to limit what "may" happen, then I can very well miss the opportunity. I think I am worried about bringing in someone else, and how it will affect Storm. But then, he could very well find another and bring her in ;) I think I need to be open to what may happen, because you never know ;)

[JaneQSmythe]

So true JaneQ! I hadn't really thought about that...if I attempt to limit what "may" happen, then I can very well miss the opportunity. I think I am worried about bringing in someone else, and how it will affect Storm. But then, he could very well find another and bring her in ;) I think I need to be open to what may happen, because you never know ;)

Thanks for the validation - I was afraid that I got a little to into the "sauce" analogy and failed to notice that we were in the "blogs" section (I usually try not to write such lengthy posts here).

It's true, Storm may get lucky and find his AWESOME sauce on his first venture whereas you may have to wade through gallons of mediocre sauce. I think that acknowledging all of the possibilities helps you from being blindsided by outcomes that were dismissed as being unlikely...because you NEVER know.

JaneQ

[Glitter]

Oh my, yes, so true! :D Thank you again, it's truly helpful :D

[Storm77]

Well since the night of our HUGE fight I've tried to stay off here, mainly not wanting to loose it and get myself banned :p As Glitter said I read her posts anyways since she would usually mention she posted something and if I wanted to come on to read it. In our case shes right here so we try to talk about things without making it into a online daytime drama like before lol.

So... even with my feelings of hating Poly, I did feel bad for her feelings when S (Music or whatever she was calling him now) opened his mouth about how she should dump me causing her to just end it on the spot with him.

Further without any mention of Poly my stress level has gone way down and been feeling pretty damn good but... I know that is still what Glitter wants and in a way since it's open for her I would also love to have some good feelings, be it either more sex or fetishes or a love relationship too.

I've also missed how fucking damn good she felt, self-confident, aggressive, etc when she was talking to guys, looking for someone to go out with etc. This even more so since as we opened the door to Poly we also opened the door to other fetishes/lifestyles and the fetish side in me bloody misses that D-side of her :o

I'm thankful I was given a break and truly HOPE with the poly stuff continuing it will actually go slow this time. ie common sense, friends first, several dates before that OMG I'm so totally in luv feeling takes her over again. She mentioned someone suggested 1 year before considering someone moving in and also maybe hold off on sex till something which is longer than typically the first date no mater "if it counted or not" *ducks*

I'm not sure sure if it was ever covered but to explain what I mean by slower...

What happened with S & P (Music and Petal) not sure how many days Glitter talked with Music, I think only a couple. Lets say Monday, Tuesday or Wednesday. On Friday they travel in to meet us at our home and have dinner. They act surprised and say they never do this but would we at all be interested in going to their place for the weekend till Monday.

Saturday was very casual and that night Glitter and I talked well how would you feel if... revolving around sex. Glitter says shes really into Music. I said find Petal very attractive and what if she wanted sex? Do I? Do I say no? Basically how are we both feeling about this. If I can obviously Glitter can with Music too. We both agreed if it happens it happens. I still was unsure about Petal but still don't know basically is she a slut based on how she talks and her actions. Twice saying she could get Music a pretty good discount on work done for his car but "but aside from flirting you know I might have to..." (using hand gestures for a blowjob and intercourse) this was after our talk about if sex was ok and pretty much closed off any chance that on my side! At least at that time till I new Petal better.

Now I may be wrong but from my perspective by the time we came home on Monday we were both questioning how good things could be. While at the same time if it'll work out, if they will stay together, if they break up how will that effect us. Then on Tuesday it seemed like Glitter was fully in relationship mode. She changed her profile statuses, updating she has found someone and no longer looking.

So in "taking it slower this time" I mean chat, chat a few times, then if it goes well meet (possibly with BOTH Glitter and I on the first time), then start talking about dates... BEFORE either of us considers it a "relationship" because we are overwhelmed with NRE and thinks OMG this is THE ONE! :p

We never talked about this but perhaps since we're poly maybe we should both meet whoever a secondary is on the first meeting so they know with me my Wife is part of the picture! For Glitter her Husband is part of the picture! Maybe lessen the chance of being told you should dump your spouse cause I'm SO MUCH better! Which has royally PISSED Glitter off now since it's 2 for 2 with men she had feelings for then to be told maybe she could dump the husband cause they really like her.

I admit being back open to Poly feels like adding a +1 to the stress level (in the thinking how will she handle it this time, will she always fall so hard) but who knows once I even have a few friends if not even a relationship I'm hoping and provided we keep our primary relationship healthy and ALWAYS working on the nasty lil kinks it'll balance out for me in the end.

We went over all our boundaries once again, changing any as needed, adding others. One thing I needed to know what what are We, Myself and She is looking for now?

Is another couple still on the table?
Are we only looking for someone suitable for ourselves?
Could there be one Bi M or F for both of us? (since we are both Bi-curious)

We are both bi-curious. I only for sexually aspects, not sure what she would want/need out of it. Since she is also enjoying learning to be more Dom I suggested maybe a younger bi sub male would work out for both of us. I know heading into that Unicorn thinking now and this might be leading into something more fitting for Fetlife than here.

*shrugs* Honestly I admit it has come up almost every time when I ask her "do you think he's bi?" :o I guess in my thinking it would be so much easier having only one extra person added to our relationship. At least for now since this is still all so new. It would be bad enough with both of us totally straight and each seeking one of the opposite sex or a couple. I think we both agree we really want to settle the "curious" part in this lifetime LOL.

Ugh it's difficult enough dealing with the way it changes a mono relationship with adding a M for her, F for me or a Cpl for us both. Now add wanting to try a M with me, a F with her. If we form additional relationships with partners in a polyfidelity structure. Then want to explore or add same-sex partners after that how will our first secondaries feel about trying others to settle our curiosities and if those then form into new secondary relationships how would they feel about each other. Would any want to also be involved with each other, how would that effect the feelings of everyone else, etc. I know Polyamory can include many partners and a bigger family. Can ya tell I'm TOO OCD and LOGICAL!? The relationship dynamics makes my head spin LOL :P

Anyways... Not a rant, I actually am still keeping this good mood going for days now without any major drops mood wise.

Kinda leaning to really suggesting we maybe get a lil sampler of sauces to try which we like and on what foods :cool: before we we get dinged for the total price for a bigger long-term size jars of just one sauce for each of us.

http://www.averagebetty.com/images/finger_wingsauce_glam420.jpg

[Hannahfluke]

I'm on my phone and the quote feature is hard to use on it, so I'm skipping it. But I wanted to address the part of your post, Storm, where you were talking about polyfidelity. It sounds like you feel that if anyone is added for more than just friends with benefits that it will have to be in a polyfidelity situation. You talked a lot about "what if we then want to experiment with being bi, it'll be next to impossible." You do realize that it is possible to have a long term, loving, caring secondary relationship without it being polyfi, right? Sure, it's harder, it means more juggling of time and energy than otherwise, but just because someone besides Glitter is in your life long term doesn't mean it has to be a closed relationship.

The poly cluster I'm a member of has very few polyfi relationships (if any) but that doesn't mean any of us are any less committed to our partners than someone who is in a polyfi relationship. My husband and his girlfriend have been together for 3 1/2 years. I've been with my boyfriend for 10 months. My husband's girlfriend is married and has an additional boyfriend who she's been with for over a year. While my boyfriend hasn't dated anyone regularly since we got together, that option is open and he has started dating someone else off and on. Safe sex takes on a special meaning in an open group and time management is sometimes a bitch but it is possible to have long lasting, meaningful relationships that aren't polyfi.

[nycindie]

Wait a minute -- I'm confused.

Are you guys going to hold off on pursuing poly until after you've worked on your relationship with each other some more, or not?

You both seem really impatient. I think you would benefit from stepping back and building your foundation to be stronger, develop better communication and deepen your intimacy with each other. I see that you both have issues with anger, too. Therapy or counseling would be the next step I see for you two, seriously.

Poly can wait, sheesh! Reconnect with each other before connecting with anyone else. Why in such a hurry?

[Glitter]

Cindie, we are slowing the fuck down, lol. We both have interests (platonic friends and other activities) that we are pursuing. We've had the talk about having friends first, and seeing how things go. We're not actively "seeking" anyone out, but sometimes things just develop, and we're not going to close the door completely.

We are working on us. Poly is something that brings us closer together, because it forces us to sit and actually discuss the nitty gritty about our relationship. We have a unique relationship, as 90% of the people (and counselors we've seen in the past) have told us. We simply discuss everything. Sometimes other factors get in the way (such as NRE I had with Music, which taught the both of us a much needed lesson), but in the end, it always gets discussed and worked through.

I don't have the time or space to detail our relationship here, but we are solid. Yes, sometimes we argue and then things get vented online. That needs to stop, as so many people take it the wrong way. Better to vent in a journal or something no one else will read. People only get a small view of things when venting happens online.

Neither of us are in a hurry, really. We're not closing the door on poly, we do have an amazing relationship. It's not displayable online, sorry I can't prove it to you. We both have our own issues (Storm has anger issues/depression/possibly bipolar that he is seeing a psychologist for, I have borderline personality/depression/ptsd that I am seeing a psychologist for, we are both seeking a marriage counselor that will take our insurance), but they are not the be-all and end-all of who we are. I apologize if you are confused, but in all honesty, we can't write and accurately lay out who we are on this site. I think that would be a novel instead of a blog, lol!

I'm not pretending that everything is perfect. It isn't. It will never be, lol. We're human, not robots. I don't expect a perfect life with Storm, and I know he doesn't expect it of me. We do discuss our feelings a lot more now, because we do stay in touch with how the other is feeling, especially now that we've opened.

Hannafluke, thank you for that! It's something we've been discussing and trying to wrap our minds around (more Storm than I on that particular subject). Definitely something to talk about more, thank you ;)

And Storm, it wasn't the next day or two...it was more than a week after meeting, we went on a date, then another week when we decided to pursue a relationship together. So no, it wasn't instant ;)

[SNeacail]

it wasn't the next day or two...it was more than a week after meeting, we went on a date, then another week when we decided to pursue a relationship together. So no, it wasn't instant ;)

Because a week is sooooo much longer than a day or two.:eek::p Start thinking in months. To me only a few weeks would seem instant.

Venting is OK, even online, but you have to remember, that people will call you on your shit, even if your "just venting". If we are completely unreasonable and unfair during avent, that can translate into being unreasonable when it actually comes time to find a solution. However, it does help to write it all out, read it and re-read it to see WHERE you are being unreasonable or unfair to your partner. If anonymous people are "taking things wrong" in one of your posts, it is very possible, that your spouse will "take it wrong" also, when you eventually say it out loud. Think of it as a lesson in effective communication. Seriously, this happens at my house all the time. Each of us THINKS we are communicating clearly, only to realize too late, that the other person heard/understood something completely different (different galaxy different). Learning how to communicate well takes practice, which unfortunately also means you screw it up and have to try again and again and again...

[Glitter]

Because a week is sooooo much longer than a day or two.:eek::p Start thinking in months. To me only a few weeks would seem instant.

I am well aware of that. My point was that I didn't just meet someone and then that same day say we were "in a relationship". It took well over 2 weeks for us to come to the conclusion that we were both interested in moving forward. I wasn't jumping into a full blown LTR with the guy, just saying I was pursuing it.

I would also like to point out, my time line is not your time line. Not saying it won't take months or even years (I expect it will), just saying we all opporate differently and are not all on the same path. I don't assume anything about anyone until I am with them and getting to know them. I didn't change my statuses all over the place, I simply changed what I was looking for. My husband has the most horrible sense of time, seriously. Something (to him) happened weeks ago, actually happened hours ago, and other things (to him) happened instantly, while they took weeks :p

Venting is OK, even online, but you have to remember, that people will call you on your shit, even if your "just venting". If we are completely unreasonable and unfair during a vent, that can translate into being unreasonable when it actually comes time to find a solution. However, it does help to write it all out, read it and re-read it to see WHERE you are being unreasonable or unfair to your partner. If anonymous people are "taking things wrong" in one of your posts, it is very possible, that your spouse will "take it wrong" also, when you eventually say it out loud. Think of it as a lesson in effective communication. Seriously, this happens at my house all the time. Each of us THINKS we are communicating clearly, only to realize too late, that the other person heard/understood something completely different (different galaxy different). Learning how to communicate well takes practice, which unfortunately also means you screw it up and have to try again and again and again...

Understandable ;) I have no problem with being called out on my shit, because if I am in the wrong, there is no two ways about it. However, I do have to say that what Storm and I talk about in person, is vastly better than what is posted online. I hope people get what I am saying, that we don't post everything here, nor do we resolve anything between us here. Quite often we discuss things to post here before we do, but then sometimes we post without talking first.

My point is, we do communicate very well. Some things may be misunderstood or misspoke, but we do have very effective communication skills. Our counselors have all said it, we communicate very effectively. It's just the anger or hurt that needs work - don't assume everything is black and white, because we all know there are many shades of grey.

[Storm77]

I think I'll try my fucking best NOT to post on here anymore. I have my wife here with me, WE can talk things out as we have for 10 years. Venting on here has only caused us more stress and problems within our relationship!

As she says using fucking nicknames on here and for others there is no bloody way we can share EVERYTHING about our lives, our relationship, our home situation, our money problems and our friends on here so the idiot peanut gallery can properly analyze our posts and tell us how we should change our lives based on their small opinions.

Yes I acknowledge some of you have been Poly for years, some are in it just for the slut reasons, some for love, etc. To each their own... what we are looking for is unique to our values and way of life, just as the past couple we've been talking about on here said "THERE ARE NO FUCKING RULES IN POLYAMORY!!!" to each their own again! In our relationships we set our rules and boundaries, don't like them? then fuck off! LOL :p

Glitter thought this would be a great place for support but that has been proven totally wrong. I admit it IS a great place for information to read other peoples dirty laundry and try to learn from it but as for support and friends it has been zip, nada, zero on a personal level.

I think Glitter started this as a Blog/Journal as a healthy way to discreetly get things off her chest in the same way she would write in her own personal journal. Although with us both on here just as I would NOT be reading her personal journal here in real life. Most of the time it's felt like this is separating us in an indirect way when she comes on to blog her problems. I come on when I need to vent too. We both correct each others dirty laundry publicly online putting on a great show for everyone.

What we BOTH need are actual real "friends" to chat with, bounce ideas off, get advice from, etc.

I may be old-fashioned but in like calling your best friend up on the phone to bitch about your problems, go out and rant over coffee. Hell in this online world even through IM, Skype, etc. Just as you would NOT SCREAM off your balcony to your friend in the next apartment complex HEY I NEED TO TELL YOU THIS BITCH TODAY.... blah blah blah. AND YOU KNOW SHE TELLS ME... CAN YOU FUCKING BELIEVE THAT!? Another neighbor says to SHUT THE FUCK UP! Yet another says HEY I FUCKING KNOW HER, I'M GONNA KICK YOUR ASS!

Oh btw since we need to tell everything to give person a better view of our live so they can judge us... I masturbated before I got outa of bed, took a piss, brushed my teeth, took vitamins and pills. Came out here told Glitter Good Morning and I love you... Checked my email, did shit online. did some yard work. More shit around the house. Just had dinner now and I need to get off here since I really need to shit :p

Cheers, have a good one :)