Safe Sex question

[BaconWrappedCupcakes]

I recently found out that my BF has not been using condoms with his other GF, and they haven't for sometime long before he met me.

I had asked him on a few occasions if he used them all the time and he said yes.
Obviously he lied to me.

We are now at an impass. I am struggling with the idea of ever being intimate with him again. I asked him to use condoms with her and he refuses saying he won't bring it up because she would be hurt.

He has taken the stance of I amd the Dom and you are the sub and you will fall in line she is just a vanilla girl and I can't control her.

I'm so hurt and depressed. I feel humiliated and used.

Any advice you have would be greatly appreciated.

[Derbylicious]

This is your health that we're talking about! Although you can't control what he does with anyone else you have the right to say that unless he wears a condom with her that he won't be having sex with you. This is one of those things that you really shouldn't give up control on. I would also go and get tested ASAP to make sure he hasn't passed anything on to you.

[nycindie]

I would think a Dom would be more concerned for taking care of you, not less. But whether he is your Dom or not is irrelevant. He has completely and utterly disrespected you, lied to you, and risked your health in an unforgivably cavalier fashion. If I were you, my relationship with him would be over. Get tested immediately. End of story.

[ray]

He sounds kind of childish. Fluid bonding is serious stuff and your health and safety even more so. If his other partner would be to hurt to consider safe sex? Well, then, she doesn't sound too mature. Having adult conversations about safe sex has nothing to do with being her Dom or not. He can't make her use protection but he should be smart enough to refuse to have sex with out making sure its safe for him and you first. Not only did he risk your health but he also lied about it. I'd have a hard time trusting him too. I'm not sure I'd be able to trust some one after something like that. I would definitely reconsider his position in your life.

[AnnabelMore]

Break. Up. With. Him. Someone who's so shockingly ignorant of what a loving dom/sub relationship should look like that he would say "your health and comfort in this situation don't matter because you're the sub" is someone who should NEVER EVER EVER be in a position of power over someone else. Untrustworthy, gross, lying, manipulative, immature bastard. Not that this would be remotely okay if you two were vanilla -- I'd still call him names and advise breaking up with him asap -- but it makes me all the more upset because I wish people like him would stop giving D/s a bad name.

[SchrodingersCat]

D/s arguments only count when both partners are consenting.

You did not consent to this.

If he lied about that, you can bet he's lying about other things too.

For the record, if he were to suddenly "agree" to use condoms with her, I wouldn't believe him. He's clearly willing to lie and say whatever you want to hear.

Taking risks with your health is flat-out abusive.

[redpepper]

Wellll, ya, everyone has said it for me. Thanks all. :)

Its quite simple for me really. "No condom. No sex. I will hang out with you and play footsies, but I will go and get laid elsewhere thank you very much. If you want sex with me again, well, it likely won't happen. Damage done. That just isn't something I give second chances to."

I'm sorry he hurt you. I an imagine that is very hard to deal with. Still, not the end of the world, go and find someone that treats you better and show him that you deserve better than what he is dishing out.

[BaconWrappedCupcakes]

Thank you for all the replies. I did tell him that we would no longer be having sex and def no oral sex unless he started using condoms.
He then responded by saying I was putting him in a bind by making him choose her or me even though he would continue to use condoms with me (so I'm not sure how I'm making him choose). He then asked if I would consider seeing him in just a D/s capacity without the sex.

This of course broke my heart, makes me feel like our sex life is nothing to him.

I've been with him for over a year now and yes it is hard to walk away from that. He said he knew she was clean and I was not at risk for anything.

[AnnabelMore]

He said he knew she was clean and I was not at risk for anything.

*You* get to decide how much risk you're willing to take on, not him. If he can't respect your right to make your own decisions how can you guys have any sort of trust-based relationship?

To me, it's all about the lying and it's sad because it didn't have to be this way. He could have said to you I'm thinking of opening up to fluid exchange with my gf, can we talk about it? Maybe you two could have come to some compromise. But instead he makes the decision on his own, lies to you about it, and opens you up to risk you didn't sign on for. To top it off, when you call him on it he accuses *you* of being manipulative!!! That's the real kicker, because if he can't accept fault he can't change.

I know it must be incredibly hard after a year together, but he's showing his true colors. I wouldn't allow him to be your partner OR your dom. This is not a safe or respectful person.

[LittleSara]

The worst part is walking away... But once you do, you will have so much more respect for yourself and feel more confident in what you believe is right for you.

His manipulative talk sounds incredibly familiar. I know it's confusing and hurtful. But you have to see through it. You are not making him choose anything. He is making YOU choose. And your options with him are terrible.

It's going to be up to you what to do. But just remember ... sometimes a Sub has to pick up the paddle and show them what she's made of.

[BaconWrappedCupcakes]

I know. I've started the process of backing away from him. He is still pushing to see me. I know this is going to take sometime to do. I love him very much and trying to focus on the good that we've had isn't working anymore.

I'm tired and hurt. He continues to think that just ignoring it will make it go away. :(

My slight relationship I had with her is now non-exsistant. So contacting her is out of the question. I don't think though that she would be as upset with this as he says she would be. She posted on another board that she offered it to him (partially because she wanted to fluid bond with her other BF) and he turned her down saying "he knows what he has with me"

He later said, after I confronted him (that post was how I found out that they weren't using protection) he said that he meant he was happy with our sex life. I don't think that's what he meant, but it doesn't matter.

[FireChild]

I'm so sorry he broke your trust. That's not what D/s is about at all. :(

[redpepper]

He's your Dom and hers? Or was? Sounds like she is the dom here. She's calling the shots if he agreed to this. A crap one at that. A good dom would not put his sub at risk and certainly wouldn't allow his sub to call those kind of shots. He's a child and not dominant if you ask me.

[BaconWrappedCupcakes]

She is a "bottom" but about 9 months into our relationship they together chose to end the D/s type stuff out of their relationship. I am his sub. And yes Redpepper I feel like they both think I am both their subs. Through the course of this I have been forced or maybe asked very sternly to do things to make her happy.

I don't think that she would be as upset with this comprimise as he lets on, but then again she hates me. (this is a whole other post, I did write one a while back about it on here but nothing came of the topic)

I am trying to keep my feelings regaurding things she has said or done out of the equation and focus on the condom issue with him. He continues to say I am forcing him to chose between us. And I don't feel I am.

I am supposed to see him tomorrow, a platonic lunch. We haven't been intimate in weeks now, but he has seen her (on a day that was supposed to be mine, but I won't dwell on that) and been intimate.

If I choose to look past this and just sweep it under the rug I know I will regret it, yet my heart is crying for him to hold me. Ugh, I'm such a wreak.

[FireChild]

She is a "bottom" but about 9 months into our relationship they together chose to end the D/s type stuff out of their relationship. I am his sub. And yes Redpepper I feel like they both think I am both their subs. Through the course of this I have been forced or maybe asked very sternly to do things to make her happy.

I don't think that she would be as upset with this comprimise as he lets on, but then again she hates me. (this is a whole other post, I did write one a while back about it on here but nothing came of the topic)

I am trying to keep my feelings regaurding things she has said or done out of the equation and focus on the condom issue with him. He continues to say I am forcing him to chose between us. And I don't feel I am.

I am supposed to see him tomorrow, a platonic lunch. We haven't been intimate in weeks now, but he has seen her (on a day that was supposed to be mine, but I won't dwell on that) and been intimate.

If I choose to look past this and just sweep it under the rug I know I will regret it, yet my heart is crying for him to hold me. Ugh, I'm such a wreak.

Some day there is going to be a guy who understands that control isn't about taking away a person's choice but about loving someone enough to put them on a path that brings them immense pleasure and joy. He's going to respect the gift of your submission and treat you with such reverence. Kick this fucker to the curb so you can find Him.

[BaconWrappedCupcakes]

Lol, thank you for making me smile ( that is what I want and need) and laugh (he def got a few choice "unsubly words" thrown at him, as he says, when I found all this out) tonight FireChild :)

[AnnabelMore]

Some day there is going to be a guy who understands that control isn't about taking away a person's choice but about loving someone enough to put them on a path that brings them immense pleasure and joy. He's going to respect the gift of your submission and treat you with such reverence. Kick this fucker to the curb so you can find Him.

Yes!! Well said. Free yourself and heal, and find someone who will bring you joy without laying this blatantly manipulative bullshit on you.

[BaconWrappedCupcakes]

:) Thank you all for all the advice and kind, well to me ;) , words. I will update tomorrow with how the lunch goes.

Sleep well.

[SchrodingersCat]

I am supposed to see him tomorrow, a platonic lunch. We haven't been intimate in weeks now, but he has seen her (on a day that was supposed to be mine, but I won't dwell on that) and been intimate.

If you read this before the lunch, I would just tell him you're not forcing him to choose anything. You're making your own choice about your safety.

He's saying that to be manipulative and make you feel that you're to blame. You are not to blame. He is, 100%.

[Openman]

He said he knew she was clean and I was not at risk for anything.


Just to re-iterate what others have said. He's trying to cover his lies with rationalizations. This is, to me, an unforgivable lack of integrity.

I'm sorry to hear about your pain. But if you live with integrity in your relationships, I can't imagine that it could be productive in anyway to stick around someone who does not live with the same level of integrity.

I would move on.

[redpepper]

If you read this before the lunch, I would just tell him you're not forcing him to choose anything. You're making your own choice about your safety.

He's saying that to be manipulative and make you feel that you're to blame. You are not to blame. He is, 100%.
Absolutely! He doesn't feel in control and is pouty because he is suppose to be the dom in your relationship. I think he lost that right when he put you in jeopardy. Good doms make decisions for subs with their consent and best interest in mind. He did neither.

[BaconWrappedCupcakes]

Well lunch went well. I chose not to discuss what has been going on because I just get upset and angry. I chose to enjoy the limited time we had to see if I could in fact enjoy his company once more. And I did because I care for him so much.

It will be close to two more weeks before we would have a chance to be intimate and I can't tell you how that is going to go. We have set up a few lunch and dinner dates in the mean time. I still have concerns of how I will feel when we finally do have sex, but I suppose I'm willing to risk it(hurt feelings) to at least try.

[nycindie]

Are you insane?

[BaconWrappedCupcakes]

Probably. I keep feeling like if I can 'forget' about her and focus on him that it'll get better.

[nycindie]

But HE is the one who abused you and totally fucked you over, not her. She may be an asshole, but he completely disrespected and devalued you. Can't you see that? He is untrustworthy and shouldn't be excused for his behavior. Why in the world would you even remotely think about being sexual with him again? HE LIED TO YOU. About something extremely, crucially important. The fact that a guy like that could be domming anyone is another reason why I find the whole D/s scene distasteful -- seems like there should be a test you should pass or an apprenticeship to undergo before being allowed to do it.

But you need to find a way to gather up all your sense of self-worth and look at this objectively, as if a good, close friend were in your position. What would you say to her? "Oh, no big deal, she's a nutty bitch and he was polite at lunch, so what if you get infected with STDs and STIs? So what if you didn't have all the facts about what risks he was taking? He's the dom, he is in charge. So, why not keep putting yourself in the position of doormat? I mean, you're submissive, right?" Wrong.

Have a little self-respect, hon. This guy doesn't deserve you.

Oh, and have you scheduled an appointment to get tested yet?

[Minxxa]

Probably. I keep feeling like if I can 'forget' about her and focus on him that it'll get better.

SHE is not the problem.

Hey, it's your life. You may not have known what you were getting into before but you're now knowingly choosing to be with somebody who does not have integrity. At this point expecting him to act honestly and not risk your health is ridiculous, so you're going into this knowing he will lie to you and do things that might subject you to things that could hurt you.

And if you think he won't you haven't been listening to your own story.

[AnnabelMore]

Ok, I feel the need to say we've been kind of inundated lately with stories of cheating and unsafe practices. Most of them have nothing to do with D/s. Yes, that's an aspect of the OP's situation, so it makes sense to factor it in, but most doms wouldn't act like this and most subs wouldn't take it. And there *are* tons of classes, books, seminars, and web resources out there on how to be a good dom (ALL of which focus on safety, respect, and consent, OP!!!), but I don't see some sort of official licensure process as being a likelihood any time soon (though that would be interesting). It's just a matter of trust and common sense, the first of which has been broken (as happens to so many couples) and the second of which is being ignored (the suggestion to think about what you'd say to a friend in this situation is a really good one).

OP, please do look out for yourself -- he's made it clear that he doesn't have your best interests at heart. :(

[nycindie]

Ok, I feel the need to say we've been kind of inundated lately with stories of cheating and unsafe practices. Most of them have nothing to do with D/s. Yes, that's an aspect of the OP's situation, so it makes sense to factor it in, but most doms wouldn't act like this and most subs wouldn't take it.

Oh, I know, I know, I know, blablabla. Calm down, I get it. I was simply stating my opinion, and it is just my opinion, okay. You don't have to go around defending D/s every time someone cites something they don't like about it. I can hold two opposing views at the same time - my own personal distaste for it on one hand and understanding how it can benefit some people on the other. I was basically agreeing with you! Even though I have no D/s experience, it was pretty obvious that he was not domming ethically and with care and concern for the OP as his sub. I don't need to be scolded or schooled if I say D/s doesn't appeal to me because of someone who abuses his dominant position.

It is a factor in this case because he used it as an excuse to say she couldn't complain about his actions. Guys like him just add to the cringe factor for someone like myself who tries understanding the draw of that kind of arrangement. I cringe not so much about D/s itself but more about the kinds of creeps and damaged individuals that glom onto alternative sexual practices and wind up doing harm. Because of that, there is an extra need to be careful about who to be involved with, to stay safe. I can see that with the right people who have their heads screwed on straight, it can be safe and enjoyable. I think it's more a comment on societal attitudes toward sex in general that make practices like D/s (not just D/s, okay) appeal to people who aren't always as ethical or right in the head as they should be -- especially before entering into an agreement where they are dominating someone else. Ugh.

[AnnabelMore]

Ugh yourself. You're right, we are totally agreeing. But I feel completely justified defending D/s and talking about the way I see it if you're going to take the time to tell the OP that you find her lifestyle distasteful on multiple levels ("another reason"). Yes it's your personal opinion and you're entitled to it but I don't see how mentioning your negative feelings about it here on her thread would serve *any* function except to possibly make the OP feel bad because you think the way she does relationships/sex is gross. I've been in her shoes in that regard. It doesn't feel good and it certainly doesn't make anyone more amenable to advice.

[nycindie]

...I don't see how mentioning your negative feelings about it here on her thread would serve *any* function except to possibly make the OP feel bad because you think the way she does relationships/sex is gross.

Now you're putting words in my mouth! I never said nor implied that the way the OP does relationships or sex is "gross." Come on now. In no way was I denigrating the OP.

The fact that a guy like that could be domming anyone is another reason why I find the whole D/s scene distasteful ...
Not much different from what you said:
... it makes me all the more upset because I wish people like him would stop giving D/s a bad name.

[AnnabelMore]

I don't want to fight -- I respect you a lot, I think you're giving great advice, and we're hijacking the thread. You're keeping an open mind such that you can give advice on something you personally dislike to someone who needs it and that's admirable.

I spoke up because I found the word distasteful to be an unnecessary thing to put out there to the OP. It means "causing dislike or disgust; offensive; unpleasant", and the people who practice D/s *know* that lots of people feel that way, it seems harsh to point it out needlessly. I am probably being over-sensitive as you said you felt that way about the scene, not about any particular practice or type of person, but that scene is many people's home, y'know.

For someone who says she doesn't want to hijack the thread, I sure as hell can't shut up. *sigh* Sorry, OP.

[FireChild]

*clears throat*

I like you. You seem like a really nice person and your screen name warms a very special corner of my fatty fat heart. Because of this I want you to listen to me carefully. I will preface my words with the acknowledgement that sometimes the heart wants what it wants and that no one can tell you how to live your life.

This. Motherfucker. Ain't. Shit. Leave him immediately. He doesn't respect you, your body OR your feelings. His other girlfriend is a straight up certified bitch but if he is so easily swayed that a snatch can cause him to forsake all integrity and moral bearings then guess what? He STILL ain't shit AND he's weak to boot.

You can do better.

[SchrodingersCat]

Probably. I keep feeling like if I can 'forget' about her and focus on him that it'll get better.

Focus on this: He is a liar. He is untrustworthy. He played with your safety like a cat with a ball of yarn.

I understand that you want to forgive him and pretend that everything will be ok if you can just forget about it.

Will you still feel that way if he infects you with HIV? What if you're in a scene and he ignores your safe word because that would spoil his fun?

This has absolutely nothing to do with her. Nothing. It's about the scumbag loser that he is, for lying about something so obviously important to you.

[SchrodingersCat]

The fact that a guy like that could be domming anyone is another reason why I find the whole D/s scene distasteful -- seems like there should be a test you should pass or an apprenticeship to undergo before being allowed to do it.

There are scumbags in every scene, every walk of life. If anything, people in the lifestyle are in a better position to protect themselves because there is information and education available. Think of all the teenage girls getting convinced by their boyfriends to forego protection, under the guise of "it's ok baby, I'm a virgin too." When people get involved in the lifestyle, and someone with experience notices how naive they are, it's not uncommon to take them through a crash course of self-protection.

Education is really what's more important than apprenticeship. I mean, electricians and contractors go through apprenticeships, but that doesn't stop some of them from cutting corners to save a buck. At the end of the day, the "consumer" has to be self-educated and aware of the situation.

[BaconWrappedCupcakes]

I'm sorry I haven't replied in a few days, been away from the computer. During this time I had the opportunity to see my BF and the original plan was to be intimate. As the day drew closer I found myself torn with the idea of being with him sexually.
I now see that sitting with him at a restaurant I can handle but even just thinking about being sexual with him has my stomach turning.
We ended up just going to the park and talking for a while. We disscussed that situation again but nothing came of it. He again spent the day that should be mine with her, which I assumed he scheduled it that way since he wasn't getting sex from me.

He's supposed to call in a little while to talk about this again. But I know my stance and how I feel isn't going to change. He just isn't getting it, but I probably added to that by trying to pretend that everything was ok when it wasn't.

I think that for the first time I realized that I will never be ok with this and that I have to begin the process of moving on. :(

[Minxxa]

Good for you BWC for listening to your instincts. Still, that doesn't mean it doesn't suck. :-/

Pain does fade, though, and we all have to learn these little lessons. It helps us define our boundaries better and that helps us choose better partners and protect ourselves better.

[Magdlyn]

It's so hard to find a good Dom. Goodness knows, my gf has been looking for a Master for the almost 3 years we've been together, on several websites (ok cupid, collarme and Fetlife) and in real life, and has found nothing but Dom-asses.

We are friends with 3 couples and one triad tho, who have healthy Master/slave relationships, that are respectful and full of balance and good health. So, it's not impossible to find this!

Good for you for sticking up for yourself, Bacon. Keep your standards high!